SD8A820WA-HNF 4/3 Sensor Cam Arrived

tmbm50

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Hi Folks,

I ordered two of these SD8A820WA-HNF from Andy and they came in today. I'm gonna work to get them setup but thought people would appreciate seeing some test videos in the meantime.

I'm not a professional reviewer so let me know what you would like to see from a sample video.

I'm excited to see how this 4k monster performs with the 4/3 Sensor at night
 

bigredfish

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Congrats! That is a monster sensor. Should be awesome in low light. Daytime it will be incredible naturally, but any cheap camera can look good with enough light.

Love to see some night/low light footage with movement in the scene..
 

ljw2k

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I also look forward to some night time video with moving objects and forget the daytime video's as above most cams are good to excellent in the day with enough light.
 

tmbm50

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Sorry for the delay here folks....the camera is having an issue connecting at 1GB. Its stuck at 100mb and its a noticeable lag when viewing.
I have another switch to try it with but it will be a few days yet.
 

reverend

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Sorry for the delay here folks....the camera is having an issue connecting at 1GB. Its stuck at 100mb and its a noticeable lag when viewing.
I have another switch to try it with but it will be a few days yet.
A late response but looking at the specs of the camera it's only a 100Mbps interface anyway (not gigabit?)

Lag may be the switch end autodetecting 100/Half Duplex instead of 100/Full duplex - always worth checking both the switch end and camera end to make sure they match.

Likewise the specs show it was maxing out at 16Mbps in H264 mode and 14Mbps in H265 so it wouldn't need faster than 100Mbps.
 

tech101

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Looking forward for this camera specially on a low light on moving people and cars.. If this is good enough I will definitely consider getting one.. Thank you ! Also if you can post some pictures of the camera :D
 

ethaniel

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A late response but looking at the specs of the camera it's only a 100Mbps interface anyway (not gigabit?)

Lag may be the switch end autodetecting 100/Half Duplex instead of 100/Full duplex - always worth checking both the switch end and camera end to make sure they match.

Likewise the specs show it was maxing out at 16Mbps in H264 mode and 14Mbps in H265 so it wouldn't need faster than 100Mbps.
14mbps for 4k?
Well that’s a shame.

i wonder how bad the compression is on complicated sceneries (like big moving crowds)
 
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Parley

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I was looking forward to your results. I have one on order but it has been delayed by the 2 week Chinese New Year and now the coronavirus.
 

CCTVCam

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14mbps for 4k?
Well that’s a shame.

i wonder how bad the compression is on complicated sceneries (like big moving crowds)
We continue to be stifled in quality by the camera manufacturers. Look at most of the HD cameras, max bit rates of 8mbs. It's enough where's there's little movement but can be problematic with scenes involving lots of detail such as Looney's driveway test of a camera a while ago where the driveway was very textured. It's perfectly easy to understand why the bit rates are set low - for commercial set ups using large numbers of cameras, it keeps the storage and bandwidth requirements much lower and thus the installation cost.

However, my contention is with giving people no choice. There's nothing wrong with having a default mode of the current bit rates but allowing higher bit rates to be set in a "pro Mode" that maybe warns of the potential consequences on bandwidth and storage. I just find it amazing in these days of choice, that there are some manufacturers eg camera manufacturers who still ignore this and compel people to choose from quite a narrow bandwidth. It costs nothing to give people choice when it's just firmware setting. You look at most action action cameras these days, and you find either a pro mode or one or more high bit rate modes. Yet CCTV is one area where we're still being dictated into using a low rate irrespective of individual requirements eg a highly detailed capture area, or someone / organisation with a small number of cameras for whom quality may be more important that space.
 

Parley

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When I ordered my camera I had not considered the bit rates. I will be using a Hikvision NVR with of course has one channel dedicated to the camera. The big 4/3" sensor with all the pixels and 4K/8MP may slow things down some. That is a lot more data to be transferred per frame compared to say the 4MP cameras with the 1/1.8" sensor. 15fps would do for me.
 
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Parley

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OK, I just did a bit rate comparison with its brother camera the 4MP with 1/1.8" sensor. Here is the DH-SD8A840WA-HNF: H.265/H.264: 512K ~ 8192Kbps.

Here is the bit rate for the 4K/8MP camera DH-SD8A820WA-HNF with the 4/3" sensor: H.264: 24Kbps–16384Kbps and H.265: 9Kbps–14410Kbps.

That is quite a difference. I will be looking into a new NVR for later in the year with more TB capacity. I may need to look into the bit rate also. Always learning something new. :)
 

ethaniel

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OK, I just did a bit rate comparison with its brother camera the 4MP with 1/1.8" sensor. Here is the DH-SD8A840WA-HNF: H.265/H.264: 512K ~ 8192Kbps.

Here is the bit rate for the 4K/8MP camera DH-SD8A820WA-HNF with the 4/3" sensor: H.264: 24Kbps–16384Kbps and H.265: 9Kbps–14410Kbps.

That is quite a difference. I will be looking into a new NVR for later in the year with more TB capacity. I may need to look into the bit rate also. Always learning something new. :)
it’s not only the bitrate, it’s the compression quality too. Good compression require alot of cpu power which ptz cameras simply do not have. It can be compensated with higher bitrate, but having 16mbps for a proper 4k is simply not enough.
 

ethaniel

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Does that apply to all 4K PTZ cameras?
Good question. If somebody can find me a 4K PTZ camera with a good sensor and a 50mbps feed, I'll grab it right away.
I have a Hikvision 1080p PTZ beach cam - even at 15mbps (maximum possible bitrate and "high" quality) I can see heavy artifacts on waves or crowds during direct sunlight.
 

CCTVCam

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it’s not only the bitrate, it’s the compression quality too. Good compression require alot of cpu power which ptz cameras simply do not have. It can be compensated with higher bitrate, but having 16mbps for a proper 4k is simply not enough.
There are lots of factors tbh. The main indicator bit rate may be the culprit is the appearance of compression artefacts in highly detailed or moving scenes. Compression algorithm, lens quality and sensor quality .(both important as you get out what you let in!), sensor size if light is a premium and bit rate to mention a few factors. Most are beyond our control as most happen in camera. It doesn't matter if you can set 100mbs in Blue Iris or an NVR if the camera's stream out is 8mbs because the source will always be the limiting factor. Trying to upscale the source when re-compressing in BI / NVR, may actually degrade the quality further. The way forward on bit rate if there is one would be for the manufacturers to offer some form of Pro Settings where you can select a high bit rate and thus low compression from an advanced menu.
 
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Parley

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Or they limit the ports of the number of cameras that the NVR can run at 4K. With this discussion I am beginning to see why. This is one reason I have stuck with 8 port NVR's along with the power available per port. I am running two 8 port NVR's instead of one 16 port NVR. I am going to go back and look at all of this again.

Here is the next NVR I am looking at to purchase that has the capability of 4 8TB hard drives. It is a Hikvision DS-7708NI-I4/8P. Here is the capability spec: 2-ch @ 12 MP (20fps) / 4-ch @ 8 MP (25fps) / 8-ch @ 4MP (30fps) / 16-ch @ 1080p (30fps)

You will notice that the frames per second drives a lot of this. So if it runs all 8 channels 4MP and 30FPS, can I run all 8 channels at 15FPS @ 8MP? As of right now I would only be running 1 channel at 8mp with the others at 4MP and maybe one 2MP.

Now here is this specification: Incoming/outgoing bandwidth 80 Mbps/ 256 Mbps

Link to the NVR: DS-7708NI-I4/8P
 
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Parley

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I just ran across this for NVR's.


Number of Channels
481632

Bitrate Needed for H.264 1080P w/ sub-stream
20 Mbps40 Mbps80 Mbps160 Mbps

Bitrate Needed for H.265 1080P w/ sub-stream
10 Mbps20 Mbps40 Mbps80 Mbps

Bitrate Needed for H.264 4MP w/ sub-stream
26 Mbps52 Mbps104 Mbps208 Mbps

Bitrate Needed for H.265 4MP w/ sub-stream
13 Mbps26 Mbps52 Mbps104 Mbps

Bitrate Needed for H.264 4K w/ sub-stream
40 Mbps80 Mbps160 Mbps320 Mbps

Bitrate Needed for H.265 4K w/ sub-stream
20 Mbps40 Mbps80 Mbps160 Mbps
 
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