What to do about this gutter on a conduit run?

[Sybertiger]

DO NOT run UTP cable in metallic conduit. If you absolutely must use conduit, use PVC.

A little light physics lesson: Whenever an electrical charge is applied to wire a magnetic field is generated. Yes: Even in very low-voltage scenarios. As the electric field changes, so does the magnetic field surrounding the conductor. Conversely: External magnetic fields induce current in nearby conductors. (This is why you don't want to run network cabling alongside power wiring.)

In a UTP network cable you have two pairs of wires generating constantly changing magnetic fields around their conductors. The size, twist ratios in the individual pairs, and relationships between the pairs all are part of the design of UTP cable that allows it to carry up to gigabits per second of data.

When you place UTP cable in metallic conduit you upset this careful design, because the conduit will affect the magnetic fields surrounding the cable. Furthermore: Any charge the conduit may pick up, and it is, after all, one long antenna of a sort, will be induced back into the cable.

Don't be touching metal during a thunderstorm...not because lightning will hit the metal then shock you (well, that's a reason too) but because the magnetic field from the lightning strike can induce a voltage on metal.

 

[Dramus]

Don't be touching metal during a thunderstorm...not because lightning will hit the metal then shock you (well, that's a reason too) but because the magnetic field from the lightning strike can induce a voltage on metal.

Tis true. I actually saw this, once. Very close-by lightning strike. So close I heard the sizzle. Saw a big spark jump from the aluminium sliding door in the door wall to the frame. Several bits of electronics in the home theater system shut down, too. (Luckily there was no immediate damage.)

 

[Shadeth]

DO NOT run UTP cable in metallic conduit. If you absolutely must use conduit, use PVC.

Well.... I am anoob at this so whoops! I am kinda committed to this right now. If my signal is jacked up, I'll know why! I'm going to see how it works with just the one conduit already in place, and the wire. I'll report back later.

 

[Sybertiger]

I'm thinking about running gray PVC conduit underground to a tree in the front yard and mounting a cam. But, I need to study more about the best way to isolation the incoming cat6 when coming into the house. I don't think I need outdoor cat6 if everything is kept from exposure to water, heat, elements, et al. Don't know if grounding is or is not advisable for your metal conduit.

 

[Dramus]

Well.... I am anoob at this so whoops!

This is why it pays to research, research, research, then ask questions, first

If my signal is jacked up, I'll know why! I'm going to see how it works with just the one conduit already in place, and the wire. I'll report back later.

The bandwidth demands for video surveillance cameras isn't particularly high, so I doubt you'll have problems.

 

[Dramus]

I need to study more about the best way to isolation the incoming cat6 when coming into the house.

This may seem counter-intuitive, but cabling in the ground is as susceptible to lightning damage as is airborne cable. Many a well pump has been lost to nearby lightning strikes. See @sebastiantombs' comments in the "which Ethernet cable" thread, re: STP cable installation.

I don't think I need outdoor cat6 if everything is kept from exposure to water, heat, elements, et al.

I've never done buried Ethernet wiring, so I'm not sure, but the ground is, well, ground. Same principles that apply to metal conduit may apply to a degree. Personally, I'd be inclined to invest in direct burial Ethernet cable, even putting it in PVC conduit, and be done with it. I like to do things, have them be done, and not have to redo them later

See my caution to @Shadeth, above. Do your homework first.

 

[sebastiantombs]

I'm thinking about running gray PVC conduit underground to a tree in the front yard and mounting a cam. But, I need to study more about the best way to isolation the incoming cat6 when coming into the house. I don't think I need outdoor cat6 if everything is kept from exposure to water, heat, elements, et al. Don't know if grounding is or is not advisable for your metal conduit.

I have two cameras that are mounted in trees and are fed by gel filled cable in conduit, underground. Conduit, PVC or metal, is not a guaranteed to be water tight. The difference in cable cost is actually kind of negligible when compared to the cost of a camera. If you do use underground conduit, use direct burial rated cable as an insurance policy and remember to pull more than one cable to each location.

 

[Sybertiger]

I have two cameras that are mounted in trees and are fed by gel filled cable in conduit, underground. Conduit, PVC or metal, is not a guaranteed to be water tight. The difference in cable cost is actually kind of negligible when compared to the cost of a camera. If you do use underground conduit, use direct burial rated cable as an insurance policy and remember to pull more than one cable to each location.

How about some pics of your tree cam installations. Maybe in a new thread so as not to hijack this one....I apologize to the OP Shadeth.

 

[sebastiantombs]

Nothing special. What I did was ran 1/2 PVC in a trench and transitioned to 1/2 flex, underground, at the base of each tree. The transitions got three coats of rubberized paint, two layers of rubberized tape then another three coats of rubberized paint since that would be a particularly weak point that could allow water entry. The flex is attached to the trees with dual hole straps mounted on 1/4x1 aluminum bar. The bars are mounted with a single center screw. The trees grow fast enough to pinch anything that gets screwed directly on them. The flex and cameras got a coat of sort of a greenish-brown paint to blend a little better. The biggest problem is sway in high winds causing false triggers.

 

[Shadeth]

Ok, so I decided when I go around the corner (another day) to just use bare cable (which will easily go behind the gutter) and paint it. One other thing to report... The 10' straight conduit from my attic does not seem to cause any interference in the video signal! But I'll keep it in mind to not use that metal conduit for this in the future. It might have been more of an issue if I did a full conduit run. This is an image of my computer monitor showing the view from one camera that goes down that conduit line looking into my backyard.

 

[sebastiantombs]

Normally, when mettalic conduit is installed for an electrical system it is naturally grounded by the electrical system ground. Hanging a piece of metallic conduit is like hanging a 10 foot antenna, a little longer than a 1/4 wave on CB, say a 1/4 wave around 20-25MHz. Depending on the local RF environment that can present problems, sometimes.

 

[mat200]

Normally, when mettalic conduit is installed for an electrical system it is naturally grounded by the electrical system ground. Hanging a piece of metallic conduit is like hanging a 10 foot antenna, a little longer than a 1/4 wave on CB, say a 1/4 wave around 20-25MHz. Depending on the local RF environment that can present problems, sometimes.

Easy enough to ground metal conduit.

 

[Sybertiger]

Ok, so I decided when I go around the corner (another day) to just use bare cable (which will easily go behind the gutter) and paint it. One other thing to report... The 10' straight conduit from my attic does not seem to cause any interference in the video signal! But I'll keep it in mind to not use that metal conduit for this in the future. It might have been more of an issue if I did a full conduit run. This is an image of my computer monitor showing the view from one camera that goes down that conduit line looking into my backyard.

What camera model did you end up going with?

 

[IAmATeaf]

I would personally run conduit from the attic space all the way down the side of the gutter pipe to the spot where you want the cam.

 

[Shadeth]

What camera model did you end up going with?

I have a few different cameras but the one on the backyard is the EmpireTech IPC-HDW2231R-ZS
In hindsight I don't really need the varifocal lens, but it had good reviews and supposed to be great night vision and clear image. This is my first day using it so I can't really review it just yet.
Oh and I will ground that conduit just in case. Don't want lightning blasting my whole system.

 

[sebastiantombs]

The varifocal can come in handy of you ever move that camera. I have one and it works really well, especially at night.

 

[Tom S]

DO NOT run UTP cable in metallic conduit. If you absolutely must use conduit, use PVC.

A little light physics lesson: Whenever an electrical charge is applied to wire a magnetic field is generated. Yes: Even in very low-voltage scenarios. As the electric field changes, so does the magnetic field surrounding the conductor. Conversely: External magnetic fields induce current in nearby conductors. (This is why you don't want to run network cabling alongside power wiring.)

In a UTP network cable you have two pairs of wires generating constantly changing magnetic fields around their conductors. The size, twist ratios in the individual pairs, and relationships between the pairs all are part of the design of UTP cable that allows it to carry up to gigabits per second of data.

When you place UTP cable in metallic conduit you upset this careful design, because the conduit will affect the magnetic fields surrounding the cable. Furthermore: Any charge the conduit may pick up, and it is, after all, one long antenna of a sort, will be induced back into the cable.

I would like to read more on this if you have a good link or something to share.