Review-AI NVR 4216-I

[looney2ns]

So, just for fun. I had my wife try to setup this NVR from scratch....to put it mildly, it would have been thrown in the street and ran over multiple times by her after 2 hrs of struggling with it, if I wasn't around to stop her. And she is NO stranger to tech. And of course, like most consumers, it would leave a very bad taste in her mouth for that brand name forever. The companies are not doing themselves any favors by not thoroughly vetting these products prior to release.

 

[c hris527]

So, just for fun. I had my wife try to setup this NVR from scratch....to put it mildly, it would have been thrown in the street and ran over multiple times by her after 2 hrs of struggling with it, if I wasn't around to stop her. And she is NO stranger to tech. And of course, like most consumers, it would leave a very bad taste in her mouth for that brand name forever. The companies are not doing themselves any favors by not thoroughly vetting these products prior to release.

Well hopefully the feedback will get back to Dahua through Andy about the shortcomings of this model and a lot of frustration has been saved because of your efforts @looney2ns.

 

[looney2ns]

Well hopefully the feedback will get back to Dahua through Andy about the shortcomings of this model and a lot of frustration has been saved because of your efforts @looney2ns.

If you are in need of any frustration, I have plenty left over to go around and share.

 

[Arjun]

Has there been any new firmware release to address the shortcomings? @EMPIRETECANDY

How well do the AI settings work with non-AI Dahua cameras?

 

[Arjun]

Technically the popular 2mp Varifocal Dahua turret can work with this NVR's smart features, right? In other words, non-AI cameras can get AI-capability through the NVR, right?

 

[Arjun]

5216-
· 16 Channel IP video access
· Smart H.265+/H.265/Smart H.264+/H.264/MJPEG
· Up to 16 Channel perimeter protection
· Up to 4 Channel video stream face recognition
· Up to 24 face pictures /sec processing
· Up to 20 face databases with 100,000 face images in total
. 1-8 PoE Ports support ePoE & EoC

4216-
· 16 Channel IP video access
· Smart H.265+/H.265/Smart H.264+/H.264/MJPEG
· Up to 4 Channel perimeter protection
· Up to 2 Channel video stream face recognition/8 channel
picture stream face recognition ( with FD camera)
· Up to 12 face pictures /sec processing
· Up to 10 face databases with 20,000 face images in

 

[looney2ns]

Yes, @Arjun. I just tested a 5231 with the NVR using the choice of "device" for AI function, and it worked. When set to human, good to go. When set to Automobile only, it didn't see me. So yes it works when using smart search in the NVR.

This NVR and the Review-Dahua IPC-HFW7842HP-Z AI, ANPR Ultra 8MP Varifocal Starlight Cam still do not play nice together.
I'm going to ask Andy if there is an updated firmware for this NVR or it could still be an issue with the firmware for the 7842 cam.
The NVR is not receiving commands from the camera, nor is it receiving MetaData from the camera.
Setup the cam from it's interface, and the instructions don't get sent to the NVR.
Try setting up the cam from the NVR, and some functions will change, but then they don't record what they are supposed to record to the NVR. Some functions won't respond like when trying to setup ANPR, the "Rule" setting does nothing. Either from the NVR's gui or from the NVR's webgui.

The camera is working well by it's self, when recording to the SD card.
I have not been able to get face recognition to work, either from the camera or the NVR.

 

[Arjun]

Thanks, do you think this NVR is an alternative option over OpenALPR?

Yes, @Arjun. I just tested a 5231 with the NVR using the choice of "device" for AI function, and it worked. When set to human, good to go. When set to Automobile only, it didn't see me. So yes it works when using smart search in the NVR.

This NVR and the Review-Dahua IPC-HFW7842HP-Z AI, ANPR Ultra 8MP Varifocal Starlight Cam still do not play nice together.
I'm going to ask Andy if there is an updated firmware for this NVR or it could still be an issue with the firmware for the 7842 cam.
The NVR is not receiving commands from the camera, nor is it receiving MetaData from the camera.
Setup the cam from it's interface, and the instructions don't get sent to the NVR.
Try setting up the cam from the NVR, and some functions will change, but then they don't record what they are supposed to record to the NVR. Some functions won't respond like when trying to setup ANPR, the "Rule" setting does nothing. Either from the NVR's gui or from the NVR's webgui.

The camera is working well by it's self, when recording to the SD card.
I have not been able to get face recognition to work, either from the camera or the NVR.

 

[looney2ns]

Thanks, do you think this NVR is an alternative option over OpenALPR?

Not as it stands now...not even close.

 

[c hris527]

If you are in need of any frustration, I have plenty left over to go around and share.

I have been REALLY looking into these NVR's, especially the ANPR functions and what its going to take to make this work at some point. The White papers for the DHI-NVR4216-16-16p-I and DHI-NVR5216-16-16p-I went side by side on my desk and this might be worth noting, It seems that Dahua has left a Caveat or a CYA in the ANPR description on both white papers Verbatim. My Takeaway on this is that they are saying that you need a ITC Model Dahua camera for it to work properly. They must have fucd around and tested this stuff before they put this out and KNOW this already. What I think is that the ITC Cams are fully stand alone functional and work pretty well, the NVR's are depending on this camera type for some of the processing and metadata to make it work.This is all speculation on my part but when you see little caveats in the description it surely makes you wonder.

 

[Arjun]

Good observation. Better to save your money and just stick with Blue Iris instead, lol Not worth the time making a wishlist as we all know that its going to take a while (if ever) such features ever make it to the consumer level (and actually work) at some point. Companies always seem to make you want to buy new products even when there is already a way to deploy a similar level of purported features in older models.

I have been REALLY looking into these NVR's, especially the ANPR functions and what its going to take to make this work at some point. The White papers for the DHI-NVR4216-16-16p-I and DHI-NVR5216-16-16p-I went side by side on my desk and this might be worth noting, It seems that Dahua has left a Caveat or a CYA in the ANPR description on both white papers Verbatim. My Takeaway on this is that they are saying that you need a ITC Model Dahua camera for it to work properly. They must have fucd around and tested this stuff before they put this out and KNOW this already. What I think is that the ITC Cams are fully stand alone functional and work pretty well, the NVR's are depending on this camera type for some of the processing and metadata to make it work.This is all speculation on my part but when you see little caveats in the description it surely makes you wonder.


View attachment 48973

 

[looney2ns]

I have been REALLY looking into these NVR's, especially the ANPR functions and what its going to take to make this work at some point. The White papers for the DHI-NVR4216-16-16p-I and DHI-NVR5216-16-16p-I went side by side on my desk and this might be worth noting, It seems that Dahua has left a Caveat or a CYA in the ANPR description on both white papers Verbatim. My Takeaway on this is that they are saying that you need a ITC Model Dahua camera for it to work properly. They must have fucd around and tested this stuff before they put this out and KNOW this already. What I think is that the ITC Cams are fully stand alone functional and work pretty well, the NVR's are depending on this camera type for some of the processing and metadata to make it work.This is all speculation on my part but when you see little caveats in the description it surely makes you wonder.


View attachment 48973

Thanks @c hris527 I was afraid that was the issue all along the way they behave together. Ugh, another fine example of Dahua's different development departments obviously do not communicate with each other. IE stay on the same friggin page.

 

[Arjun]

Frankly, this occurs in other companies as well, especially those companies which tend to cater to both enterprise and consumer markets. That's why its wise to share your data anonymously (when prompted with a user agreement), pun intended, lol

Thanks @c hris527 I was afraid that was the issue all along the way they behave together. Ugh, another fine example of Dahua's different development departments obviously do not communicate with each other. IE stay on the same friggin page.

 

[craigspc]

I’m currently in the middle of preparing an order for some cams from @EMPIRETECANDY. My original plan was to go with Hikvision ColorVu cameras, but the Dahua IPC-D5442E-ZE (pro AI model) looked quite interesting for my front and back door, as it offers a wider viewing angle and lists face image capture / facial attribute recognition in the spec. I then spotted the NVR4126-16P-I (possibly a POE Version of the NVR reviewed here?) in Andy’s store, which appeared to offer a further extension of the built-in camera features. This was enough for me to consider switching to a mostly Dahua solution for my system upgrade, but now I’ve seen this review of the NVR and feel very insecure about going ahead with the order. Have there been any firmware updates since October? Or has anyone perhaps had experience with other cameras in the meantime? Thanks!

 

[looney2ns]

I’m currently in the middle of preparing an order for some cams from @EMPIRETECANDY. My original plan was to go with Hikvision ColorVu cameras, but the Dahua IPC-D5442E-ZE (pro AI model) looked quite interesting for my front and back door, as it offers a wider viewing angle and lists face image capture / facial attribute recognition in the spec. I then spotted the NVR4126-16P-I (possibly a POE Version of the NVR reviewed here?) in Andy’s store, which appeared to offer a further extension of the built-in camera features. This was enough for me to consider switching to a mostly Dahua solution for my system upgrade, but now I’ve seen this review of the NVR and feel very insecure about going ahead with the order. Have there been any firmware updates since October? Or has anyone perhaps had experience with other cameras in the meantime? Thanks!

Not that I'm aware of. If you go up a model to the 5216 Ai series, another member here @Wildcat_1 states that it's working as it should. He's working on that review currently.

 

[craigspc]

Not that I'm aware of. If you go up a model to the 5216 Ai series, another member here @Wildcat_1 states that it's working as it should. He's working on that review currently.

Thanks for taking the time to reply, looney2ns. I really appreciate the feedback (and your earlier review). The fact that @EMPIRETECANDY provided the unit for honest testing is also the reason why I’m trying to buy everything from him.

Had the Facial recognition features worked, the 4216 AI would feel like a purchase that is hard to resist. But with 19% VAT + customs fees in Germany, the 5216 AI could potentially amount to a 900 dollar box. That figure really brought things into perspective for me.

Thanks again.
Craig.

 

[craigspc]

Hmm.. Forgive me if this is a dumb observation/comment, but I notice that in contrast to the description on the Dahua International website - the product data sheet on the Dahua US website excludes support for 8 channel picture stream face recognition (requiring FD camera) from the spec of the NVR4216-P16-I (which I’m still assuming to be the POE version of the box you tested).

Instead, the data sheet only seems to mention video stream facial recognition on up to 2 channels.

Could that mean that facial recognition might work with up to 2 non AI cameras? Or perhaps it requires that certain face detection features are disabled in cameras that support this internally?

Here’s a link to the document that I’m referring to:

https://us.dahuasecurity.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/Datasheet_16ch_ePoE_Analytics_1U_16HDD_DHI-NVR4216_16P_1_001_004.pdf

Edit: sorry for editing this post so many times. I’m just trying to get it as accurate as possible, which is difficult when I’m not quite sure what some of the terms mean.

 

[craigspc]

The more I look into this, the more confused I get. Could it be that Dahua are marketing the same product with different features in different regions (using the same model names)?...

Product 1: NVR-4216-16P-I (Lite-AI Series)
This data sheet mentions picture stream recognition (with FD Cameras) and video stream recognition

Product 2: NVR-4216-16P-I (Ultra Series Smart with Analytics+)
This data sheet only mentions video stream recognition, but makes a bigger deal of Analytics+ (Non FD Cameras?).

Depending on what you make of the above, I’d be really interested to know if the NVR from @EMPIRETECANDY supports face recognition with non AI cameras.

 

[c hris527]

Hmm.. Forgive me if this is a dumb observation/comment, but I notice that in contrast to the description on the Dahua International website - the product data sheet on the Dahua US website excludes support for 8 channel picture stream face recognition (requiring FD camera) from the spec of the NVR4216-P16-I (which I’m still assuming to be the POE version of the box you tested).

Instead, the data sheet only seems to mention video stream facial recognition on up to 2 channels.

Could that mean that facial recognition might work with up to 2 non AI cameras? Or perhaps it requires that certain face detection features are disabled in cameras that support this internally?

Here’s a link to the document that I’m referring to:

https://us.dahuasecurity.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/Datasheet_16ch_ePoE_Analytics_1U_16HDD_DHI-NVR4216_16P_1_001_004.pdf

Edit: sorry for editing this post so many times. I’m just trying to get it as accurate as possible, which is difficult when I’m not quite sure what some of the terms mean.

The spec sheets from Dahua are difficult to digest at times, sometimes you need to read between the lines. If they are excluding it, there is a reason.

 

[craigspc]

The spec sheets from Dahua are difficult to digest at times, sometimes you need to read between the lines. If they are excluding it, there is a reason.

Yes, I’m certainly struggling. The fact that I’ve found two data sheets, which appear to show the same model numbers but differing face recognition and ANPR features leave me very confused.