Are alerts possible without NVR or BI?

bugsysiegals

Getting the hang of it
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
179
Reaction score
27
Location
Racine, WI
I'm installing some cameras soon with 128GB SD Card. I have no issues in the neighborhood and only need to know when kids are sneaking out at night or sneaking people over when I'm away. That said, I only need to record motion, receive alerts, and able to review the video stream as needed.

Can I receive alerts without NVR or BI? FWIW - I have a Raspberry Pi connected to the network so perhaps it could be some intermediary device to send alerts and move files to the cloud or a NAS attached to the router? What do I miss without BI?
 

58chev

Pulling my weight
Joined
Aug 30, 2017
Messages
300
Reaction score
143
Location
Etobi, Ontario
What Cameras?

I have Hikvision's and they are setup to send email alerts. I would think other brands have the same capability but don't quote me on that. ;)
 

fenderman

Staff member
Joined
Mar 9, 2014
Messages
36,902
Reaction score
21,274
How are you going to turn off those alerts when you get home
 

bugsysiegals

Getting the hang of it
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
179
Reaction score
27
Location
Racine, WI
These are the Dahua 5231 and 5831's. I'm not familiar with whether it needs a NVR to make any action besides recording to SD card.

With regards to the alerts, I'm not familiar with how they work so I'm not certain how to answer your question Fenderman. Does the camera record on motion and automatically send alerts? I was thinking to use the Raspberry Pi to have it check the SD Card for images and when it detects new ones send alerts based on a time schedule. I'm mostly concerned for the PC since it's in my wood shop which can be quite dusty and thus trying to understand how the camera works and what options I might have.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2018
Messages
18
Reaction score
3
Location
dallas
These are the Dahua 5231 and 5831's. I'm not familiar with whether it needs a NVR to make any action besides recording to SD card.

With regards to the alerts, I'm not familiar with how they work so I'm not certain how to answer your question Fenderman. Does the camera record on motion and automatically send alerts? I was thinking to use the Raspberry Pi to have it check the SD Card for images and when it detects new ones send alerts based on a time schedule. I'm mostly concerned for the PC since it's in my wood shop which can be quite dusty and thus trying to understand how the camera works and what options I might have.
i'm on the same page as you ... i plan on just using 2x 5231 with 128gb sd cards .. i just want to be able to record 2-3 days and view them remotely
which poe switch did you go with if you don't mind me asking
 

bugsysiegals

Getting the hang of it
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
179
Reaction score
27
Location
Racine, WI
I purchased a rack mount Cisco ws-c3750-48ps-s a few years ago for ~$250. It puts out 370 watts but is only a 10/100 switch with IEEE 802.3af. Sadly you can get them for < $50 now.

While it will work for the short term, I want something which fits within my Leviton media panel box which is quiet. Depending on Black Friday deals I'll likely buy a 16 port PoE switch dedicated to cameras and/or access points and a separate switch for all my other wired devices. I'd then connect the switches to my router and configure DD-WRT to VLAN those ports so the cameras cannot see the outside world. I'm not certain if I can then allow the BI computer from the internet VLAN to communicate to the cameras, if it needs to be on the same camera VLAN and have no internet, or if I have 2 NICS and connect 1 to the camera VLAN and 1 to the Internet VLAN.
 

bugsysiegals

Getting the hang of it
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
179
Reaction score
27
Location
Racine, WI
I just reviewed some of the website below and it seems the camera has the ability to set various schedules, send alerts, etc., but I assume the alerts will not work when we firewall them from the internet, is that correct?

I'd really like to understand what BI provides that I would need versus what the cameras provide on their own ... can anybody elaborate? If I created firewall rules to allow the cameras to only pass SMTP traffic to the internet, would this eliminate my need for BI?

How do you disable alerts when you get home with BI ... are you using IFTTT? I was considering perhaps IFTTT could interact with a Raspberry Pi which would then connect to the camera to disable alerts but not sure if this is possible.

https://dahuawiki.com/IPCamera
 

fenderman

Staff member
Joined
Mar 9, 2014
Messages
36,902
Reaction score
21,274
I just reviewed some of the website below and it seems the camera has the ability to set various schedules, send alerts, etc., but I assume the alerts will not work when we firewall them from the internet, is that correct?

I'd really like to understand what BI provides that I would need versus what the cameras provide on their own ... can anybody elaborate? If I created firewall rules to allow the cameras to only pass SMTP traffic to the internet, would this eliminate my need for BI?

How do you disable alerts when you get home with BI ... are you using IFTTT? I was considering perhaps IFTTT could interact with a Raspberry Pi which would then connect to the camera to disable alerts but not sure if this is possible.

https://dahuawiki.com/IPCamera
Nothing eliminates the need for blue iris...you can disable blue iris alerts by simply clicking on the traffic signal on the mobile app or changing the profile on the mobile app.
 

bugsysiegals

Getting the hang of it
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
179
Reaction score
27
Location
Racine, WI
Are you speaking from your need for BI or in general, I’d still need it in my situation even though I only need motion alerts during specific times?
 

fenderman

Staff member
Joined
Mar 9, 2014
Messages
36,902
Reaction score
21,274
Are you speaking from your need for BI or in general, I’d still need it in my situation even though I only need motion alerts during specific times?
particularly because you need those alerts. but do this, try it your way...then come back when you are frustrated.
 

bugsysiegals

Getting the hang of it
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
179
Reaction score
27
Location
Racine, WI
:) It didn't say in the cliff notes that either NVR or VMS is required and it was my understanding after reading the Dahua wiki that the camera can do all I need on it's own. I must have misunderstood the wiki, are you saying the camera records on it's own but cannot trigger the alerts without NVR or BI?
 

fenderman

Staff member
Joined
Mar 9, 2014
Messages
36,902
Reaction score
21,274
:) It didn't say in the cliff notes that either NVR or VMS is required and it was my understanding after reading the Dahua wiki that the camera can do all I need on it's own. I must have misunderstood the wiki, are you saying the camera records on it's own but cannot trigger the alerts without NVR or BI?
The camera can certainly trigger alerts... The problem is getting those alerts to stop...
 

bugsysiegals

Getting the hang of it
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
179
Reaction score
27
Location
Racine, WI
Ok, now we're getting somewhere ... so the IVS alerts from the camera will likely have to many false alerts versus BI thus the need for BI?
 

fenderman

Staff member
Joined
Mar 9, 2014
Messages
36,902
Reaction score
21,274
Ok, now we're getting somewhere ... so the IVS alerts from the camera will likely have to many false alerts versus BI thus the need for BI?
you want alerts while you are home? you want alerts while you are in the backyard? you need a mechanism to easily disable alerts...setting aside that reviewing video from each camera is a pain in the ass...look..im done explaining..try it your way..really, you should, That way you will appreciate the difference. Hell, buy an NVR too, that way you can really appreciate the difference.
 

Mike

Staff member
Joined
Mar 9, 2014
Messages
2,982
Reaction score
2,725
Location
New York
Depending on what system you use, most apps, like hik-connect have motion alerts that you can enable and disable easily.
 

fenderman

Staff member
Joined
Mar 9, 2014
Messages
36,902
Reaction score
21,274
Depending on what system you use, most apps, like hik-connect have motion alerts that you can enable and disable easily.
These cannot be changed on a per camera basis. You cant disable email alerts via the app.
 

bugsysiegals

Getting the hang of it
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
179
Reaction score
27
Location
Racine, WI
Fenderman, I truly appreciate your knowledge and quick responses but if you feel irritated from responding to many times, please consider taking a few more seconds to elaborate your answers. Remember, I'm not even close to your level of knowledge here so a quick response that makes perfect sense to you doesn't necessarily bring me up to speed and I'm just trying to learn and understand.

If I understand you correctly, without a NVR or BI, I'll have to independently login to each camera to review footage, disable motion alerts, etc. whereas BI conveniently provides a central place for administration. I'm certain it has other awesome benefits but the main point here regarding the need to simply receive alerts and video review is the convenience factor which I agree would become a nuisance in short time. Thanks for sharing, hopefully somebody else will find this information helpful in the future.
 

fenderman

Staff member
Joined
Mar 9, 2014
Messages
36,902
Reaction score
21,274
Fenderman, I truly appreciate your knowledge and quick responses but if you feel irritated from responding to many times, please consider taking a few more seconds to elaborate your answers. Remember, I'm not even close to your level of knowledge here so a quick response that makes perfect sense to you doesn't necessarily bring me up to speed and I'm just trying to learn and understand.

If I understand you correctly, without a NVR or BI, I'll have to independently login to each camera to review footage, disable motion alerts, etc. whereas BI conveniently provides a central place for administration. I'm certain it has other awesome benefits but the main point here regarding the need to simply receive alerts and video review is the convenience factor which I agree would become a nuisance in short time. Thanks for sharing, hopefully somebody else will find this information helpful in the future.
That's not what I said this information is readily available all over this forum... It's clear that you're hell-bent on doing it your way... So try it you can always add the blueiris machine...
 

J Sigmo

Known around here
Joined
Feb 5, 2018
Messages
997
Reaction score
1,335
I'm not so sure the OP is bent on doing it their way versus what you're recommending. It's just a matter of them wanting to know WHY you're recommending what you are versus what they're asking about.

To the OP: It will be good for you to read the Wiki and the Cliff Notes, etc., and it's good to ask questions as you are, too. Just realize that most of this has been asked and answered thousands of times before, so some get tired of going over the same ground repeatedly. What seems like innocent questioning (and I believe it is) can seem like argument to someone like fenderman who has explained this many times, I'm sure!

Most of the cameras have apps and such, and are set up to do just what you want, at least to provide alerts, emails, etc., without needing an NVR or Blue Iris, etc.

But while they're easy to set up to do this, there are usually serious drawbacks to these fast, easy, inexpensive implementations. I've been there!

So what fenderman is pointing out is that without something more sophisticated in "the loop", like Blue Iris, for example, things can be cumbersome to get to do exactly what you want. And he's pointing out that you will likely want a fast, easy, convenient way to switch the messaging/texting/emails/alerts on and off, and perhaps have even finer control so you can enable and disable different alerts, etc., easily and really tune the system to your needs and be able to make changes easily, too. And that's where Blue Iris really shines.

It has so much capability when it comes to configuring groups of cameras, schedules for everything, and fast ways to switch modes to suit times when you're home, or just in the back yard, or out and about, or at work, etc., and have that all tie in with time of day, light conditions, whatever. Most of this won't occur to you when considering setting up a few cameras at first. But as you play with it and live with it for a while, you'll almost certainly come to wish you had better control over things. So like fenderman says, you can try it out the way you're proposing, and then as you run into things you don't like, you will likely find yourself wishing for more, better, and more convenient control over the behavior of the system. Really, that's how a lot of us have come to end up with Blue Iris. We've tried it the way the camera manufacturers provide, which is easy, cheap, and works. But then we've run into the limitations or hazards of those setups and opted for something better.

I think fenderman is just trying to move you past making some of the mistakes and get you directly into doing things right the first time. But I'm not even sure that's always possible. Lots of times we do have to play with things to learn enough to even know the right questions to ask. And that brings me to another point. I think you'll find that you get amazingly detailed answers from a lot of the folks here - answers that take them a long time and a lot of effort to formulate and then post in a painstaking way - when you ask questions that are sort of "deeper into" the whole subject. Those questions are the ones people find to be more "worthy" and more interesting, so they tend to put a lot of effort into figuring them out and explaining them.

So don't be put off. Do try to read the Wiki and Cliff Notes, and scan through some of the existing threads here, and take your time. There is, (unfortunately) a LOT to learn about all of this.

To make a system that is secure and doesn't expose your network to outside attack, works well, and provides the type of remote access you want, etc., is very possible. But unfortunately, while the cameras themselves can "sort of" do a lot of what you think you want at first, in the end, most people end up not satisfied. And just what fenderman is talking about with regard to being able to easily switch off alerts, or change things easily is one of the things may well make you unhappy very soon after setting things up. Another big problem most of us have is securing our networks while still allowing for alerts and remote access.

Still, if you get a camera and play with it in its most basic and simple modes, you'll gain some feel for all of this, so that's not necessarily an entirely bad thing or a big waste of time. Just don't expect to be completely satisfied, and don't buy a whole bunch of cameras, etc., until you've learned a bit more. Unfortunately, setting up a "perfect" security camera system is not something that can be done really fast and easy. Most of us have ended up putting a lot more into all of this than we ever figured we would when we first started.
 
Top