Camera Failure Forensics

c hris527

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I got a call that a cam i installed 6 months ago was out. I was not expecting to find what I found, this type of failure is usually caused by moisture, rain but this cam was mounted inside in a automotive maintenance shop. I did not have a weatherproof boot on it. I have installed a ton of these cams inside and out with zero failures and this is the first time I have seen one cook like this with no moisture present. Perhaps a bad crimp? always a possibility, perhaps with the hot humid weather we have been having some moisture built up inside it. It is connected to a POE Dahua NVr and the cam is a Dahua
HNC3130R-IR-Z-S2 3mp bullet. Perhaps a defect in the cam.
I did replace the cam and was able to bench test it with a 12V wall wart, it did click on so all is not lost.
I did look at the connection and it was bone dry.

burn.jpg burn1.jpg
 

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fenderman

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I got a call that a cam i installed 6 months ago was out. I was not expecting to find what I found, this type of failure is usually caused by moisture, rain but this cam was mounted inside in a automotive maintenance shop. I did not have a weatherproof boot on it. I have installed a ton of these cams inside and out with zero failures and this is the first time I have seen one cook like this with no moisture present. Perhaps a bad crimp? always a possibility, perhaps with the hot humid weather we have been having some moisture built up inside it. It is connected to a POE Dahua NVr and the cam is a Dahua
HNC3130R-IR-Z-S2 3mp bullet. Perhaps a defect in the cam.
I did replace the cam and was able to bench test it with a 12V wall wart, it did click on so all is not lost.
I did look at the connection and it was bone dry.

View attachment 32522 View attachment 32523
could be a power surge...also it is possible that there was a leak in the roofing or that someone sprayed water on it and it dried before you got there.
 
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Looks to me as if dirty water (condensation?) got into the connector. I had similar issues with a couple of outdoor cameras until I wised up and bought waterproof connectors.

I suggest cleaning it with some 90% isopropyl alcohol, along with contact cleaner spray. Use some q-tips to wipe out the gunk and you may be able to bring the camera back.
 

c hris527

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could be a power surge...also it is possible that there was a leak in the roofing or that someone sprayed water on it and it dried before you got there.
Could be, I know their were nasty thunderstorms and power outages in the area bout that time. The power was coming through the NVR and as far as I know nothing else got hit.
 

Valiant

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Did the NVR POE port survive? Are they surge protected with fuse or otherwise?
 

c hris527

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Did the NVR POE port survive? Are they surge protected with fuse or otherwise?
Yes the NVR was OK, these are direct runs with no protection to the cams, they are inside.
 

J Sigmo

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Because you can see some vaporized (and then condensed) metal on the insulating "islands" between the contacts, and this is not down at the actual contact points, I'm voting for a surge of some sort causing flashover across the "front end" of the male connector (the cable end or "plug"), that left material deposited on those insulation islands in the socket (jack).

It could have been moisture, but in my experience, that usually looks a bit different. The blobs of metal that was molten or even vapor at one point seems more like a brief high-energy event than a prolonged burn. But this is all speculation since anything is possible.

You don't need to have any kind of direct lightning hit to get damage. Two other mechanisms can cause damage from nearby lightning.

One is simply induction. You get a nearby lightning strike, and the very high current pulse creates an EMP event where you have intense electromagnetic radiation emanating from the lightning stroke itself, basically like an extremely powerful radio signal broadcast from the "antenna" created by the ionized path through which the current is flowing. Think of the lightning "bolt" as being a temporary transmitting antenna emitting a powerful pulse of radio energy. That radio "signal" is then "received" by any conductor anywhere nearby, and the received signal strength can be extremely high. So you end up with very high voltages being induced into wiring in the area even though no direct contact was made. Again, this is like an EMP event.

Another mechanism that I've seen do damage in many situations is that the lightning strikes the ground, or a grounded object, and that immense pulse of current flows into the earth at that point. Since the earth is usually a pretty poor conductor, that current flowing through that poor conductor (the dirt, etc.) develops a large voltage gradient from place to place through the earth in the area.

We know that by Ohm's Law, voltage is equal to current times resistance. Now, a lightning bolt might carry, perhaps, 10,000 to 100,000 amperes of current for a brief moment.

From setting up many radio sites, I can tell you that a "good" earth ground can be at least 25 Ohms. Dry earth is a crummy conductor! Now, imagine the lightning strike, carrying, say, 10,000 amperes, strikes the earth at one point. The current will spread outward from that point, traveling through the fairly-resistive earth trying to make its way to "ground" (whatever that is!). Think of a hemispherical electrical field spreading outward from the point of contact in all directions.

Now, let's say you have a ground rod driven into the earth 100 feet from the point of impact so to speak. And another one 200 feet from the point of impact. At the moment that this 10,000 amps of current is being dumped into the point of impact, the voltage gradient between these two ground rods might be many thousands of volts! Think of 10,000 amps flowing through 25 ohms. Do the math! That's a quarter of a million volts at the instant of the lightning strike.

Anyhow, even at points somewhat distant from where the lightning strikes, you will have voltage gradients in the earth that can be extreme.

So now, you've got what you imagine to be two points that are "grounded" together (by virtue of both places having ground rods driven into the earth). But the reality is that those "ground" points might instantaneously find themselves thousands of volts different.

I've seen nearby lightning strikes blow up all sorts of equipment, even within the same building, simply because different parts of the building are grounded in different places by their own ground rods.

So between the possibility of induced voltages appearing in any wire (which will act as a receiving antenna) and the possibility of highly different "ground" potentials from place to place, even a nearby lightning strike can cause damage.

The way we protected radio sites that were always on mountain tops, and always had tall towers, which, of course, are struck directly by lightning many times each year, was by creating a ground "ring" around the radio building, and providing a "single point ground" system where any electrical connection and even plumbing entering the building comes in at a single point, through a thick copper plate that is tied to the ring ground surrounding the building, but more importantly becomes the "single point ground" for everything inside of the building. Nothing is grounded by "daisy chaining". Instead, every piece of equipment has its own isolated ground wire running directly to that single point ground. Usually, a copper plate 1/4" thick, and large enough to accommodate every wire, pipe, coax, etc., entering the building.

Lightning arrestors are installed to the plate for every connection.

With this system, radio stations, repeaters, etc., operate just fine for many years despite the fact that the radio tower is struck directly by lightning frequently.

When the lightning hits, the tower, the ground around the building, and most importantly, the ground entrance plate all rise to whatever voltage is required at that moment. The whole works might momentarily find itself a quarter of a million volts away from "earth ground" potential. But it doesn't matter because all of the equipment is at that same potental. So no damaging voltages appear between pieces of equipment. So no damaging currents flow. It's all "relative".

People like to believe that there is no way to protect from lightning. But that's simply not the case. It's done all of the time or else no mountaintop radio site would survive more than a few weeks in most locations. And clearly, that's not the case.

Anyhow, the point is that we can't know exactly what happened in this case. It could have been a cut in the insulation of the CAT-X cable, shorting to a mains power wire, or it could have been a failure in the equipment at either end. Or it might have been moisture.

But don't rule out induced voltage or ground-potential-differences caused by a nearby lightning strike. Just being indoors doesn't shield you from either of these events. Believe me, I've repaired enough equipment, especially in larger buildings, to know that you don't need any sort of direct hit to have lightning damage.

Just one possibility, anyhow.
 

c hris527

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Thanks for the input, very informative.
 

c hris527

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I did clean the contacts a bit, it will not power with POE but does fine with the wall wart, was able to log into the cam so all is not lost, going to put a new pigtail on it and see how it goes.
 
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I did clean the contacts a bit, it will not power with POE but does fine with the wall wart, was able to log into the cam so all is not lost, going to put a new pigtail on it and see how it goes.
The fact that the camera is operational except for the damaged power pins makes me think that this was more likely due to moisture. Looking down into the pigtail, you can see discoloration that appears as if water had pooled into it. Water with sufficient impurities would have formed a conductive path between the power and ground pins, current would flow, and the connector would get hot, hence the damage. In turn, the heat might have evaporated the water and eventually dried out the connection.

Any type of electrical surge (direct or indirect) that could cause that much damage to the power pins would have likely also fried the serial interface connections in the pigtail, and destroyed the camera. The damage seems a bit too selective for that. If you replace the pigtail and everything comes back on line, I would bet that moisture was indeed the culprit.
 

J Sigmo

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Does a known-good camera work, powered by POE, when connected to the same port of the NVR? And how does the receptacle (and cable plug) for that camera's port on the NVR look? And what if you try both the original camera and a known-good (different) camera connected to that same port on the NVR, but using a different cable? And of course, you can try the suspect camera on a known-good NVR port using a known-good cable.

Gotta eliminate the camera's POE power converter, the NVR's POE power output, and the cable itself.

One of the nice things about Ethernet connections is that the signals are coupled through pulse transformers at both ends. This eliminates any direct DC connection between the Ethernet devices, and this affords some degree of surge protection as well as reducing noise issues by providing balanced, isolated connections. The breakdown voltage ratings for these coupling transformers vary from model to model, but can be several thousand volts.

On the other hand, the POE connections must have a direct DC path (be directly connected) from one end to the other. But the power converters at both ends, if designed well, will provide isolation, and if the PC board layout is done carefully on both ends, some protection is provided there, as well. Still, the converters themselves can be more vulnerable to these surge events than are the Ethernet ports.

Ideally, the POE outputs on the switch (or NVR) are all independent, using separate converters to maintain some isolation between channels. But this is up to the designer of the switch or NVR, of course. And the breakdown voltage between channels and between any channel and the main workings of the switch will depend on the design.

But you could potentially see damage to the POE converters on one or both ends from a surge event, and the cable itself can be wrecked by having its insulation damaged anywhere within the run. Of course, the Ethernet connections can also be damaged by surges, but in this case, we've already established that those wires within the cable must be at least workable, and the camera and NVR are working in that regard as well.

And if water did get into the connection, it could have fried the power converter in the NVR for that channel, but ideally, it would protect itself, limiting the current until the fault was gone. As @wtimothyholman pointed out, the water could have been boiled away by the current passing through it until it dried enough to remove the conductive path.

If the DC-DC converter in the camera was damaged, but the rest of the camera operates, you could theoretically use that camera in a position where it would be practical to power it with the wall wart. Maybe not for a customer, but perhaps at home or around the office, etc., where you could tolerate future problems if it was compromised in some way.

Anyhow, the cable needs to be eliminated, and the POE power from that port of the NVR needs to be eliminated as well. Finally, the camera needs to be tested on a known good port of the NVR using a known-good cable to determine if it's really got a bad POE converter or not. This is almost quicker to test than it is to describe. :)
 
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c hris527

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NO port damage or cable damage, the new cam is up and running on the same run and port, thanks for the replies.
 

c hris527

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UPDATE----FIXED

A few picks of the fix, perhaps could help others with some Dahua IP cameras. I had to jump Brown and and Brown and White AND Blue and Blue and White according to how it pinned out. Using a set of electrician scissors is helpful for small gauge wires. Punched it down and was up and running with POE power, test all aspects and controls of the Camera and No issues. Thanks again for all the Imput.



Pin-out Jumper Stress Relief Stripping

pinout1.jpg jump.jpg stress.jpg Klein.jpg
 

TonyR

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The gap in my 2 front teeth has long been perfect for stripping insulation off small gauge wiring, especially POTS wiring. I did it dozens of times until one day, when putting in a phone extension for a friend, I had one half of the ring/tip pair in my mouth stripping it, the other laying in the spit on my fingers having just stripped it, and then someone called his house....I got that 60 to 90 volts AC @ 20 Hz on my tongue and lips.

It was actually one of the lesser shocks I went on to receive periodically over the next 35 years that were unavoidable in my profession but I still recall it really "rung my bell" and decided to opt for the tool next time I needed the insulation off of a working phone line. :lmao:
 
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