DeepStack fails to find any object if the triggering source is ONVIF

[Buttan Butt]

Guys, I have a small problem and I just can't solve it by myself. Please tell me if you think you have any ideas how to get things working again.

Blue Iris is at version 5.4.3.0. Due to many changes lately I can't say at what point my problems started.

Currently I'm using the Blue Iris built in "Motion Sensor" combined with DeepStack. I must say that it works great. However I have a few cameras with built in "AI", (IPC-T5442TM-AS) and I'd like to utilize their capability to send ONVIF triggers to Blue Iris. I do that by selecting "Camera's digital input or motion alarm" as the only trigger source. That also works and creates an entry in the time line identified as "External" and any "On alert actions" that I've specified will be carried out. the problems starts if I also want to use DeepStack alert confirmation (combined with the ONVIF trigger source). Then DeepStack won't find anything no matter what I try (The ONVIF triggered alerts end up as cancelled with the text "nothing found"). Note that I'm using the same DeepStack settings that previously worked well with the Blue Iris built in "Motion Sensor". The only difference is that I'm now using ONVIF to trigger.

Strange isn't it?

EDIT: This issue has been fixed in Blue IRIS.

 

[Buttan Butt]

I was just thinking that DeepStack might not have a detection mask if not using "Motion sensor" as a trigger source.

I read in the BI documentation that "Any part of the image not covered by at least one zone is considered masked." I realized that might be the culprit here... I haven't activated "Motion sensor" as a trigger source. I have only checked "Camera's digital input or motion alarm". By not having checked "Motion Sensor", I realize that I have no motion zones defined.

I did some experimenting this morning and it seems to work if I also check "Motion Sensor" as a trigger source. An alert is created, going through DeepStack and the alert is of type "external". However it seems that all other rules defined for the "Motion Sensor" are also applied (e.g. minimum object size, object travels pixels etc etc).

My goal is to take some load off BI by not having to use the internal motion sensor trigger source and instead using some CPU on the cameras.

 

[wittaj]

Don't know if you are trying to have Deepstack analyze for things like toilets LOL, but at the moment, most of us find that the AI in the Dahua cams are pretty good...so unless you really need the little orange person or vehicle showing up in BI, just go with ONVIF for that camera!

Who uses Dahua AI capable cameras? Reliable AI for triggering events? Pro's/con's?

It has come to my attention that certain Dahua cameras come with built in AI that distinguishes between human & cars. I was unaware of this. Well, always saw the AI word used in the reviews but never really thought about it because I thought it was a Dahua NVR integration only. I am currently...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[Buttan Butt]

Don't know if you are trying to have Deepstack analyze for things like toilets LOL, but at the moment, most of us find that the AI in the Dahua cams are pretty good...so unless you really need the little orange person or vehicle showing up in BI, just go with ONVIF for that camera!

Who uses Dahua AI capable cameras? Reliable AI for triggering events? Pro's/con's?

It has come to my attention that certain Dahua cameras come with built in AI that distinguishes between human & cars. I was unaware of this. Well, always saw the AI word used in the reviews but never really thought about it because I thought it was a Dahua NVR integration only. I am currently...

ipcamtalk.com

Thanks @wittaj , you are a very helpful forum member! I appreciate that.

About the little "orange person or vehicle showing up in BI"... -We wants it, we needs it. Must have the precious. Having said that, another bonus with also running it through DeepStack is the counting of various objects that I can use for different purposes in my home automation (E.g. car:82%,person:47)

Anyway Ken has answered me today that he will fix the issue I'm having.

Meanwhile I will take your advise and see how the AI built into my Dahua cameras will do their own. I've tried various IVS functions before but I think I'll have a look into SMD too. I think I'll ask @EMPIRETECANDY if I can try the new SMD 3.0 on one of my new PC-T5442TM-AS ... Have you heard if someone has compared SMD, IVS vs DeepStack AI lately?

EDIT: Just tested SMD (without using DeepStack then of course) on my new IPC-T5442TM-AS (System Version V2.800.15OG004.0.R, Build Date: 2020-12-03 ). I activated it for both humans and vehicles. After 5 minutes came a hailstorm and the camera started to spam me intensively with false alerts. I didn't have to waiy very long for that. There was a car parked in the cameras view but it certainly wasn't moving. I wonder how smart "Smart Motion Detection" actually is... Maybe it's not mature yet. I Switched over to IVS tripline and I'll see if that's better.

Cheers!

 

[wittaj]

Do not use SMD or Motion Detection - use IVS with an intrusion box or tripwire with the box checked for humans and check the box for vehicle if you want that.

I repeat, do not use SMD or Motion Detection and make sure you have those boxes unchecked. Just go with IVS.

I have found the AI of the cameras to work even in a freakin blizzard....imagine how much the CPU would be maxing out sending all the snow pictures for analysis to Deepstack LOL. My non-AI cams in BI were triggering all night. This picture was ran through Deepstack (without the IVS or red lines on it) and it failed to recognize a person in the picture, but the camera AI did. This pic says it all and the video had the red box over it even in complete white out on the screen:

I get zero false triggers from my AI cameras using ONVIF triggers with Blue Iris.

Also make sure you are not accidentally pulling Motion Detection from Blue Iris as well. Your trigger alerts should say external. If they say Motion then it is BI motion.

 

[jonk]

Under blue irs settings go to the "clips & archiving" tab. Then click " configure convert/export". Then check " add motion overlays from direct-to-disc bvr." And check "add text/graphic overlays from direct-to-disk bvr". Then click OK restart blue irs. This fixed deepstacks for me.

 

[SFC]

Guys, I have a small problem and I just can't solve it by myself. Please tell me if you think you have any ideas how to get things working again.

Blue Iris is at version 5.4.3.0. Due to many changes lately I can't say at what point my problems started.

Currently I'm using the Blue Iris built in "Motion Sensor" combined with DeepStack. I must say that it works great. However I have a few cameras with built in "AI", (IPC-T5442TM-AS) and I'd like to utilize their capability to send ONVIF triggers to Blue Iris. I do that by selecting "Camera's digital input or motion alarm" as the only trigger source. That also works and creates an entry in the time line identified as "External" and any "On alert actions" that I've specified will be carried out. the problems starts if I also want to use DeepStack alert confirmation (combined with the ONVIF trigger source). Then DeepStack won't find anything no matter what I try (The ONVIF triggered alerts end up as cancelled with the text "nothing found"). Note that I'm using the same DeepStack settings that previously worked well with the Blue Iris built in "Motion Sensor". The only difference is that I'm now using ONVIF to trigger.

Strange isn't it?

EDIT: This issue has been fixed in Blue IRIS.

So how was it fixed? I'm seeing the same issue and I can tell what the problem is - ONVIF sends a trigger, by the time that trigger grabs from BI the moving object has already passed through the frame (car going across the frame at ~30mph). So BI is examining an image that already has had the object move through. I don't see a way to tell BI to submit an image from just-before the ONVIF trigger (even though I'm recording 24/7).

 

[King of No Where]

So how was it fixed? I'm seeing the same issue and I can tell what the problem is - ONVIF sends a trigger, by the time that trigger grabs from BI the moving object has already passed through the frame (car going across the frame at ~30mph). So BI is examining an image that already has had the object move through. I don't see a way to tell BI to submit an image from just-before the ONVIF trigger (even though I'm recording 24/7).

I had same issue, deepstack not working with IP cam motion detection.

Did a bit of playing around and now deepstaack is able to work with Camera's digital input.

I have motion detection and intrusion detection enabled in my IP cam.
But BI doesn't seem to distinguish the above and both type of alerts are flagged as external only or external and onvif alerts.


In Artificial Intelligence
Think the 3 main parameters are
+ real - time images: is one of key parameter used to have 5 didn't work so increased to 10 and deepstack is able to flag person detection.
Analyze one each: 750ms always never changed that.
Apply to motion triggers only: Unchecked.

Other settings as per below pic


I still have some playing to do... dont want to over utilize the CPU usage, on a windy day causing large number of alerts.

• Reduce the number of real time images as much possible so deepstack can detect
• Does the zones A,B, C, D have to be enabled as I'm not using BI motion detection.
• Pretty sure the Apply to motion triggers only must not be selected but again have to confirm

Will try and play around and post updates on above points....

 

[King of No Where]

To update on my above post
I can confirm on below
- real time images varies on many scenarios a fast moving object in a short field of view is not generating alert if the value is at 8, 10 do get alerts, Where as 5 is a most are missed.
-Apply to motion triggers only must not be selected - if selected and DS is enabled, DS skips the analysis and if "Fire On Alert and On Reset... " is enabled the alerts IP Cam triggered alerts also get supressed too..
-Even though BI motion detection is not selected the zones are being used by DS. In Trigger Tab under sources section -> Configure - > Advanced section -> Edit button next to "Use Zones and Hotspot" select the area you want DS to scan.