Hardware verification for 15 to 20 cameras

[fenderman]

My gaming machine/desktop is a VERY high end setup. Two high end GPUs at 250W each and a 3930k CPU at 130W and those are stock numbers and not over clocked number... yeah, I think my gaming machine running for eight hours a day will easily pull more power than the AMD machine running 24 hours


Thank you VERY much for the partial search results. It looked like the common issue with most was they were using low end NUCs(celeron, pentium, and i3/i5 which are actually mobile... not equivalent of desktop)



More awesome information.
1) I haven't had a chance to fire up the SkullCanyon to see how bad the noise is.
2) I definitely am familiar with the i3/i5/i7 distinction. Intel has done some things to muddy the water between i3/i5/i7 depending upon application. Depending upon level of overclocking, some i3s will beat i5s.
3) To follow on this, Blue Iris doesn't use quick sync for encoding for write?
4) Good news. I wasn't sure if Blue Iris liked 32GB or more 16GB is my usual for machines.
5) Thank you for the analysis here. It looks like my plan for four or six 4TB drives in raid6 will be more than sufficient. My plan is to record only motion on about six or so cameras. At least two cameras will be 'buried' so only breaking in would result in motion.

You are completely missing the point...you can flush 1000 dollars down the toilet today...doesnt mean that running that amd machine is now smart...you are spending more money running it than replacing it..where is the logic (and for the record, no, your gaming machine will not use more power...remember tdp is not a way to measure consumption...and if you are loading the system and actually gaming for 8 hours a day, you have bigger problems and dont need cams since youll be home all the time.....sell one of your nucs and replace it with a proper machine...you dont need raid and you dont need six 4tb drives if you interned to record 6 cams on motion...

 

[looney2ns]

It's always interesting those that come here asking for advice, then want to dispute advice given by many very well seasoned contributors.

 

[Lil'John]

You are completely missing the point...you can flush 1000 dollars down the toilet today...doesnt mean that running that amd machine is now smart...you are spending more money running it than replacing it..where is the logic (and for the record, no, your gaming machine will not use more power...remember tdp is not a way to measure consumption...and if you are loading the system and actually gaming for 8 hours a day, you have bigger problems and dont need cams since youll be home all the time.....sell one of your nucs and replace it with a proper machine...you dont need raid and you dont need six 4tb drives if you interned to record 6 cams on motion...

And again on the gaming machine, I agree TDP isn't a true measure of consumption. BUT, when it is running 80% CPU and 80% graphics while heavily overclocked, I guarantee you it IS pulling more power than that AMD machine. Also, a single high end gaming run for 8 hours obviously will pull more than the AMD running 2-3 days at 'idle'. As noted, my gaming machine is not your typical boutique gaming machine.

Also, you are arguing about an electric bill I clearly don't give a damn about. Let's just agree to disagree and leave this metric off any further discussion.

Nor are you fully reading any of my posts where I've clearly stated:
I CAN NOT SELL ANY OF THE FLAMING NUCS!!!
Is that loud and clear and well spelled out? The specifics of why I can not sell the NUCs are none of your concern. If the NUC isn't appropriate as others have generously provided examples of, I will not use one.

You are also clearly missing the fact that I will not be purchasing new system in the near future for this. Again, the reasons are none of your concern. Even if I was inclined to buy new hardware now, it is a poor time to do so since Intel will be popping out with Coffee Lake shortly.

You've also made it clear that you don't value your security data. Again, you have your reasons for not liking/wanting RAID. For me, the raid offers me another level of reliability. For me, the money is well spent to get another 10% in reliability. For others such as yourself, you don't feel the cost is justified; ie you don't see a need, I see a want that I can afford. Let's just agree to disagree on this.

It's always interesting those that come here asking for advice, then want to dispute advice given by many very well seasoned contributors.

I find it interesting when people comment on threads just to pad their post count and offer no useful info to the topic at hand.

I don't follow 'everyone does this' without some sort of supporting information or logic.

 

[Gilles0181]

If the NUC isn't appropriate as others have generously provided examples of, I will not use one.

Hi @Lil'John ; in the end i did NOT go for my NUC, which was indeed i5, but i would not consider it a low-end model. I had thesame dilema as you had; use a skull canyon (i had to buy it in my case) or build my own new PC for roughly thesame amount of money. I did, and this one now uses about 40w which i consider to be low power. it has a desktop I7 6700k in it

 

[wcrowder]

use windows 10..its great.
the number of cameras is irrelevant...what is relevant is the total MP and total fps...the dual amd will be a powerhog -an efficient system will pay for itself...you can buy an efficient intel based system that supports hardware acceleration for 150-500....you dont want to run any vms on a VM..also note that intel hd hardware acceleration may not work on a vm if you go with an intel system...

Not everybody cares that the system will consume 2 dollars more electricity per month, or costs $900.00. FPS "does" matter, MP "does" matter when you are using this BI for security you CAN NOT RUN LESS THEN 15 FRAMES. Small mom and pop stores run BI and need to see when their employees count money. Less then that you are watching "Time Lapse Video". Nobody want's 4fps video these days.

 

[fenderman]

Not everybody cares that the system will consume 2 dollars more electricity per month, or costs $900.00. FPS "does" matter, MP "does" matter when you are using this BI for security you CAN NOT RUN LESS THEN 15 FRAMES. Small mom and pop stores run BI and need to see when their employees count money. Less then that you are watching "Time Lapse Video". Nobody want's 4fps video these days.

Its not 2 dollar more a month...high powered systems can run 200-300 more per year.
You have no clue about security if you think you cannot run less than 15fps...have you seen the youtube comparison videos?
If you need to see an employee count money at 20fps, you can set that ONE or TWO or THREE cameras to 20fps...You can run ANY mom on pop store at 30fps with blue iris EASY...like I said, you can reality run 30 1080p cameras at 15fps or even 20fps...whats the problem? You running more than 30 cams? Not setting up blue iris properly? I never suggested you run 4fps....

 

[wcrowder]

Its not 2 dollar more a month...high powered systems can run 200-300 more per year.
You have no clue about security if you think you cannot run less than 15fps...have you seen the youtube comparison videos?
If you need to see an employee count money at 20fps, you can set that ONE or TWO or THREE cameras to 20fps...You can run ANY mom on pop store at 30fps with blue iris EASY...like I said, you can reality run 30 1080p cameras at 15fps or even 20fps...whats the problem? You running more than 30 cams? Not setting up blue iris properly? I never suggested you run 4fps....

I do this for a living. Some cashiers, that do large sums of money per day can "Fan Count" bills faster then 10 a second. The higher resolutions can allow you to identify people at a distance. Minimum regulatory FPS for cash handling in Indiana is 30 frames, 15 will work in most instances. I wish I could send you video of how fast someone can be when trying to steal.

I understand the Aim of Blue Iris, it's for us home users. I'm up to 15 cameras at home, I love 4mp, it's the perfect rez right now for home systems. I like to see the deer eat without the still frame effect. Just My opinion.

BI with a Vivotek FD816CA-HF2 camera, The AUDIO is almost perfect, also makes a really good, probably the best, "Air Gaped" interview room system. Much better then the alternatives. Simple enough that even government employees can use it.

So yeah, I know what I'm doing. All I'm saying is not everybody cares about saving $12.00 per/month for inferior video.

 

[fenderman]

Seems to me that you want to run blue iris in a commercial install of 30+ cameras but dont want to pay for it...

I do this for a living. Some cashiers, that do large sums of money per day can "Fan Count" bills faster then 10 a second. The higher resolutions can allow you to identify people at a distance. Minimum regulatory FPS for cash handling in Indiana is 30 frames, 15 will work in most instances. I wish I could send you video of how fast someone can be when trying to steal.

I understand the Aim of Blue Iris, it's for us home users. I'm up to 15 cameras at home, I love 4mp, it's the perfect rez right now for home systems. I like to see the deer eat without the still frame effect. Just My opinion.

BI with a Vivotek FD816CA-HF2 camera, The AUDIO is almost perfect, also makes a really good, probably the best, "Air Gaped" interview room system. Much better then the alternatives. Simple enough that even government employees can use it.

So yeah, I know what I'm doing. All I'm saying is not everybody cares about saving $12.00 per/month for inferior video.

If you do this for a living its surprising that you dont understand the basic concepts of pixels per foot and the small difference 4mp provides over 2mp....There is no regulation that requires X frames per second unless you are in some sort of specialized industry like gambling...in that case you should not be using blue iris...
Further note most of the 4mp "amazon" cameras you claim are popular cannot do more than 20FPS at 4mp...
4mp is subpar unless you have some serious bright light on all the time...take a look at the dahua starlight threads and see the difference yourself...
its not "inferior" its user error on your part..
You keep saying freeze frame effect..wtf are you talking about..there is no such effect at 15-20fps...

 

[wcrowder]

I understand everything you just said. Some of the "Amazon" cameras are not real Hikvisions. 20fps is good for any situation. Required to use 30fps for cash handling and could never be used in at work, LOL. Well, Actually I do, Re-read the last post, 30fps, with 1 camera, with perfect audio. If you are a contractor, you might want to try it out. I recommend it for small bushiness that need 8 cams, works perfect, easy for them to use. Set it up for a few of the neighbor's that need 4-6 cameras.

At the farm, I have 3 cameras a mile away with ptp, it's cool. All I'm saying is some of use home hobbyist would like nvidia acceleration, it would make a huge difference and we could run more cameras at usable frame rates. For those just getting started you are right on what you say.

 

[fenderman]

I understand everything you just said. Some of the "Amazon" cameras are not real Hikvisions. 20fps is good for any situation. Required to use 30fps for cash handling and could never be used in at work, LOL. Well, Actually I do, Re-read the last post, 30fps, with 1 camera, with perfect audio. If you are a contractor, you might want to try it out. I recommend it for small bushiness that need 8 cams, works perfect, easy for them to use. Set it up for a few of the neighbor's that need 4-6 cameras.

At the farm, I have 3 cameras a mile away with ptp, it's cool. All I'm saying is some of use home hobbyist would like nvidia acceleration, it would make a huge difference and we could run more cameras at usable frame rates. For those just getting started you are right on what you say.

Huh? all amazon hikvision cameras are "real" hikvision...they can only do 20fps....you are not required to use 30fps for cash-that is a requirement you simply made up..furthermore you CANT use 30fps with standard hikvision 4mp cameras so not sure where you are going with it...
The vivotek you linked to is 2mp and overpriced.....lol...I can do 60fps at 2mp with a dahua starlight...point is its not needed....you might want nvidia acceleration but you need to understand why you are not getting it....its useless for 99.9999 of the customer base...not sure why you dont get it or why you think he should implement it...let me know when you find a better solution than blue iris at this price point.

 

[wcrowder]

Huh? all amazon hikvision cameras are "real" hikvision...they can only do 20fps....you are not required to use 30fps for cash-that is a requirement you simply made up..furthermore you CANT use 30fps with standard hikvision 4mp cameras so not sure where you are going with it...
The vivotek you linked to is 2mp and overpriced.....lol...I can do 60fps at 2mp with a dahua starlight...point is its not needed....you might want nvidia acceleration but you need to understand why you are not getting it....its useless for 99.9999 of the customer base...not sure why you dont get it or why you think he should implement it...let me know when you find a better solution than blue iris at this price point.

The Vivotek has a built in microphone that blows Separate audio devices out of the water. Taking this private.

 

[fenderman]

The Vivotek has a built in microphone that blows Separate audio devices out of the water. Taking this private.

Who cares.....its a special case use camera...point is you are a special use case and want blue iris to conform to you...its not how it works...

 

[wcrowder]

Who cares.....its a special case use camera...point is you are a special use case and want blue iris to conform to you...its not how it works...

Frankly, why should Blue Iris conform to your interpretation of what it should become? Because you are a moderator of a forum you publicly say the author doesn't watch?

You do a really good job helping people on here out. BUT, you discourage a lot of possible subscribers and BI users by publicly limiting the uses of this fine software.

 

[fenderman]

Frankly, why should Blue Iris conform to your interpretation of what it should become? Because you are a moderator of a forum you publicly say the author doesn't watch?

I dont dictate what the developer should do...I am explaining the reasoning behind it that you cant seem to get through your thick skull...
The FACT is there is no nvidia acceleration and the developer indicated to a user that its not coming..so instead of bitching about it here where as you indicated it wont do any good, why have you not emailed and asked? Too easy?

 

[wcrowder]

I dont dictate what the developer should do...I am explaining the reasoning behind it that you cant seem to get through your thick skull...
The FACT is there is no nvidia acceleration and the developer indicated to a user that its not coming..so instead of bitching about it here where as you indicated it wont do any good, why have you not emailed and asked? Too easy?

I wasn't bitching, no, I have emailed support when I had questions. Pretty easy to use, didn't need to. Are you drunk?

 

[fenderman]

I wasn't bitching, no, I have emailed support when I had questions. Pretty easy to use, didn't need to. Are you drunk?

Huh? Seems like you like bitching about this but didnt bother asking the developer why it has not been implemented....Totally sober, dont like stupid discussions that go around in circles..

 

[wcrowder]

Seems to me you get upset when anyone disagrees with you. That's Ok, I guess we all do.

 

[fenderman]

Seems to me you get upset when anyone disagrees with you. That's Ok, I guess we all do.

Not at all upset. Its simply that I call stupid, stupid. Thats how it works here...dont like it? Leave.

 

[fenderman]

Post after post bitching about not having nvidia acceleration but never bothered to email the developer to find out why...

 

[wcrowder]

Not at all upset. Its simply that I call stupid, stupid. Thats how it works here...dont like it? Leave.

I guess you can ban me. But I do disagree with you.