Need to upgrade computer and graphics

[fenderman]

Actually, I just read another thread where you recommended the "small form factor" HP EliteDesk 800 G1. That would fit alright. They seem a bit pricey, or pricier... A nice segue into your question re budget... For the PC itself, about $600. Honestly, the total budget is something I'm still ramping-up on - all that is needed, like a POE or POE+ switch, Cat5 cabling, software (BI seems quite popular here), and of course cameras...

I don't want to take this discussion off course, but if there is a thread here about BI alternatives, maybe ones that are lighter or less CPU-intensive? If there is something desirable like that, then maybe I wouldn't need such a workhorse of a PC. I'll keep searching, but if you know of such a thread, kindly share. Thanks again.

The hp elitedesks are great however the sweet spot is the i5...the i7's are pricey. For BI you will need the i7. BI is adding hardware acceleration which should help but we dont know how much yet until its released..exacq will have no problems running on an i3 with your load, but will cost 50-150 per camera depending on your needs. You might want to wait until the hardware acceleration is released or holdout for a skylake system.

 

[TonyB]

The hp elitedesks are great however the sweet spot is the i5...the i7's are pricey. For BI you will need the i7. BI is adding hardware acceleration which should help but we dont know how much yet until its released..exacq will have no problems running on an i3 with your load, but will cost 50-150 per camera depending on your needs. You might want to wait until the hardware acceleration is released or holdout for a skylake system.

fenderman, you are a wealth of knowledge and most to kind to share as you do here. Thank you.

I just made some time to read-up on Exacq. Looks like pricing, which is not exactly easy to find on their website, is just one time. The "Start" is up to 16 cameras... I saw no reference to the 50-150 dollars per camera, but I believe you of course. That could be over 1,000 bucks for 12-16 cameras though... I like how it's compatible with Windows, Linux and Mac.

Compared to 60 bucks for BI though, I can see why it's so popular, even with it being a resource hog, software doing the heavy lifting, as opposed to the hardware... Sounds as though hardware acceleration is on the way. When it is here, would that entail a new purchase for existing BI users, or simply an update, free or otherwise?

Skylake systems look to be quite expensive...

I think I'll call the folks at Exacq to learn more...

 

[fenderman]

fenderman, you are a wealth of knowledge and most to kind to share as you do here. Thank you.

I just made some time to read-up on Exacq. Looks like pricing, which is not exactly easy to find on their website, is just one time. The "Start" is up to 16 cameras... I saw no reference to the 50-150 dollars per camera, but I believe you of course. That could be over 1,000 bucks for 12-16 cameras though... I like how it's compatible with Windows, Linux and Mac.

Compared to 60 bucks for BI though, I can see why it's so popular, even with it being a resource hog, software doing the heavy lifting, as opposed to the hardware... Sounds as though hardware acceleration is on the way. When it is here, would that entail a new purchase for existing BI users, or simply an update, free or otherwise?

Skylake systems look to be quite expensive...

I think I'll call the folks at Exacq to learn more...

Yes, it is 50 per camera for the start version..you may be able to get a better price if you buy a bunch. However note the limitations of the starter, which may or may not be an issue for you. For example, you cannot record to nas. You cannot set independent retention times for certain cameras..(in blue iris, there are several aux folders available allowing you to save some cameras video for longer periods of time. You dont get email event notifications, no two way audio. You only get 90 days of free software updates. See the matrix on their site.
On the other hand it will run on an i3, and can use in camera motion for all hikvsion cameras....Personally I use blue iris exclusively (except for a few older standalone nvr's)...
Windows is available for free on a refurbished machine as its cheaper than building your own, so the OS is irrelevant. You are not going to waste money on an overpriced mac to run vms.
Blue iris provides free updates for the current version. In the past there has been a three year cycle. V4 is not even a year old. So you should get at least another two years of free updates and after than the price should not increase much if anything.
Skylake i7's are about 800-1000 now...but may be something to consider if you actually intend to use BI and 16 cameras without having to compromise on frame rates. Another point is that the hardware acceleration on BI is going to be optimized for nvidia..we dont know how it will affect integrated graphics which is my preference over dedicated cards...A sff system will limit the graphics cards you can use. I would wait and see.
a mini tower 9020 seems to meet your size requirements http://i.dell.com/sites/doccontent/shared-content/data-sheets/en/Documents/Dell-OptiPlex-9020-spec-sheet_Final_V2_G13001038.pdf
Another worthy contender is this system..I cant speak for the build quality or power consumption, but for an i7 skylake with those specs (256gb ssd, 16gb memory, solid nvidia card)...for 761 (711 for amex card holders) you cant beat it..windows 7 pro-free upgrade to 10...
http://www.techbargains.com/deal/386745/hp-envy-750se
I would say that this would make a killer BI system...my only concern would be power consumption..comes with free shipping and FREE returns so it cant hurt to test

 

[TonyB]

Yes, it is 50 per camera for the start version..you may be able to get a better price if you buy a bunch. However note the limitations of the starter, which may or may not be an issue for you. For example, you cannot record to nas. You cannot set independent retention times for certain cameras..(in blue iris, there are several aux folders available allowing you to save some cameras video for longer periods of time. You dont get email event notifications, no two way audio. You only get 90 days of free software updates. See the matrix on their site.
On the other hand it will run on an i3, and can use in camera motion for all hikvsion cameras....Personally I use blue iris exclusively (except for a few older standalone nvr's)...
Windows is available for free on a refurbished machine as its cheaper than building your own, so the OS is irrelevant. You are not going to waste money on an overpriced mac to run vms.
Blue iris provides free updates for the current version. In the past there has been a three year cycle. V4 is not even a year old. So you should get at least another two years of free updates and after than the price should not increase much if anything.
Skylake i7's are about 800-1000 now...but may be something to consider if you actually intend to use BI and 16 cameras without having to compromise on frame rates. Another point is that the hardware acceleration on BI is going to be optimized for nvidia..we dont know how it will affect integrated graphics which is my preference over dedicated cards...A sff system will limit the graphics cards you can use. I would wait and see.
a mini tower 9020 seems to meet your size requirements http://i.dell.com/sites/doccontent/shared-content/data-sheets/en/Documents/Dell-OptiPlex-9020-spec-sheet_Final_V2_G13001038.pdf
Another worthy contender is this system..I cant speak for the build quality or power consumption, but for an i7 skylake with those specs (256gb ssd, 16gb memory, solid nvidia card)...for 761 (711 for amex card holders) you cant beat it..windows 7 pro-free upgrade to 10...
http://www.techbargains.com/deal/386745/hp-envy-750se
I would say that this would make a killer BI system...my only concern would be power consumption..comes with free shipping and FREE returns so it cant hurt to test

More good info, thank you again.

I spoke with an AJ at Exacq, and he did indeed share 50 bucks a camera with the Start version. Indeed, just 90 days support with third party hardware, as we are discussing here with PC options. Their LC Series box is a little over $1,000, but includes 4 camera license, so effectively a 200 dollar savings, but then gets one 3 years of updates... Updates are every quarter, but most folks typically want such when a camera dies, to get the most updated options / choices...

The limitations you call-out are important to me, at least some, like email notifications (often away from home for long stretches).

It would seem that the only negative for BI is that it does require more CPU... I'm inclined to go the BI route, so I'll need more computer. The HP ENVY 750se is way to large for the space I have though... I actually think I can make do with 12 cameras, at most 14, FWIW. I'd be recording on motion, not continuous, if that is a factor here...

I will search for i7's, ideally Skylake, in small form factors (with video card considerations, drat), hoping to score a good deal soon...

 

[TonyB]

fenderman - After reading a couple threads here on the NUC, it seems that you are not a big fan in these applications, so I feel bad bringing it up again.... But now that they have gone Skylake, maybe a viable solution with BI, or maybe just Exacq?

http://www.fudzilla.com/news/notebooks/39246-intel-s-four-new-nucs-revealed

http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/nuc/nuc-kit-nuc6i5syh.html

 

[fenderman]

fenderman - After reading a couple threads here on the NUC, it seems that you are not a big fan in these applications, so I feel bad bringing it up again.... But now that they have gone Skylake, maybe a viable solution with BI, or maybe just Exacq?

http://www.fudzilla.com/news/notebooks/39246-intel-s-four-new-nucs-revealed

http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/nuc/nuc-kit-nuc6i5syh.html

The benchmarks are not out yet, but I am certain they are insufficient for your application with BI.
I also prefer recording to a local drive...these only house 2.5 drives which can be an issue...They are also way too expensive for the performance they provide. I dont see the value in a small size.

 

[TonyB]

Alrighty, I'll let that go. I see the value in the small size, but I don't need something that small though... I will continue searching. Thanks much!

Edit / Add: I'm seeing the Dell Optiplex 9020 Micro Quad-Core i7 on eBay for less than $600, so there's that already...