New to security cameras, have a prewired home

[samplenhold]

If someone hired my company to wire 4 Cat6 cables in a house

The house is already pre-wired. And by what @greensleeves stated, they will only use two of the cams and they will just be mounted at the present ethernet wired spot.

He mentioned "low profile" like a robber swinging a bat to knock off your cameras

Well a bullet would be more susceptible to that than a turret. Besides, that rarely ever happens, and if it does, the bullet is much easier to turn away from the field of view.

company 2 about a possible lower MP camera and he says he can get me 5MP cameras for cheaper

Well again without knowing what sensor it is one cannot help you with deciding.


Would #1 give you a price for just two cams since you will only be using two? If the NVR is a Dahua and down the road you decide to change out for better cams or add a few more, you could always get cams that are Dahua prosumer grade and they would still work with that NVR.

 

[Holbs]

maybe... training? gotta go thru the steps of training folks on menu options plus remote viewing on a smartphone. training alone could be 1-2 hours.

 

[Holbs]

and for goodness sake...do not let them PORT FORWARD to your NVR! Don't want you to end up on YouTube of security home camera footage that was hacked.

 

[mat200]

Thanks holbs! We are actually not planning to add additional wires which makes me wonder why the labor cost is much higher for one company versus another. It's just them setting up the cameras and NVR, calibrating, etc. It seems like I need to get turret over bullet so definitely leaning towards that. We have realized sometimes it's easier to contract out some projects for sure. That is the case for us here...

Hi @greensleeves

Most people who are willing can learn to DIY install and setup these systems, so if you'd like to save some money on labor and get a better kit / system what would be better imho in the longer term.

Otherwise, do expect folks who know how to setup a kit to need to cover expenses, in some states there can be significant taxes ( self-employment, property, income, medicare, aca, ... etc ) as well as the need to cover costs to account for time to learn as well as equipment ( like ladders ) they need to invest it . It adds up.

Next option is you get a good kit / system and hire someone who knows what they are doing to install them for you.

As you have already wired up the locations, it should not cost too much for that. Running the cables is typically the most challenging for most folks.

 

[greensleeves]

Hi samplenhold, for company 2, the 5MP details are 3K vs the 8MP 4K. He says the 5MP cameras will be $175 each. Is this worth the cost savings? I believe this to be the only difference but he did not have a ENS link for the 5MP camera.

 

[samplenhold]

Is this worth the cost savings

Without knowing the sensor size and lens size it is not possible to give you an answer. BTW, saying that 5MP is 3K is meaningless. It is two ways of saying the same thing. You want to know the physical size of the sensor. It will be given in inches, like 1/3" or 1/2.8" or 1/1.8" are some of the more common sizes. In general the larger the sensor, the more light it gathers, the better you video will be. Knowing the lens size is also important. This is given in millimeters, like a 2.8mm lens is very wide angle and a 6mm will give you a narrower field of view so things are closer.

One reason for staying away from #2 is that if you go with a rebrander like ENS, and want to expand later, you are stuck with whatever they sell in the future. In all likelihood, only their cams will work with their NVR. Where as if you go with #1 and he gives you a Dahua NVR, then you have a huge selection of Dahua cams to choose from in the future.

It would be good to get brand and model numbers from both vendors to see exactly what you are getting.

 

[greensleeves]

Got it, thanks samplenhold!

So the response I got back from #2 was that the 5MP cameras are the same except for MP.

Company #1 says 4MP, 2.8mm, IR night up to 98 ft, 2TB HDD and sent a picture but it looked pretty generic. They are pushing the 4 pack due to "savings" (and that a "sale" ends tonight) and that the cameras are actually turret, so that didn't really increase my confidence level with that company.

Maybe I should try to solicit some more estimates or look into DIY again, if we can possibly move the AT&T box or NVR onto the shelf above the IT box? At this point we are leaning towards #2's $780 quote for the 5MP cameras. But I understand your point on future flexibility if we went with a generic.

 

[mat200]

Got it, thanks samplenhold!

So the response I got back from #2 was that the 5MP cameras are the same except for MP.

Company #1 says 4MP, 2.8mm, IR night up to 98 ft, 2TB HDD and sent a picture but it looked pretty generic. They are pushing the 4 pack due to "savings" (and that a "sale" ends tonight) and that the cameras are actually turret, so that didn't really increase my confidence level with that company.

Maybe I should try to solicit some more estimates or look into DIY again, if we can possibly move the AT&T box or NVR onto the shelf above the IT box? At this point we are leaning towards #2's $780 quote for the 5MP cameras. But I understand your point on future flexibility if we went with a generic.

Hi @greensleeves

If you want a better system you will need to purchase it yourself, and either have them install it for you - or take some time to DIY install and setup.

Also, you're not getting enough spec info from what you are sharing.

What is the sensor size in the cameras?
OEM?

Remember to check the link New to security cameras, have a prewired home

 

[samplenhold]

if we can possibly move the AT&T box or NVR onto the shelf above the IT box? At this point we are leaning towards #2's $780 quote for the 5MP cameras

Sorry I did not see the link you had in post #14. So the ENS cams have a 1/2.5" sensor and a 2.8mm lens. That is a wide angle lens and It does not say what sensor it is though. Min illumination is 0.068 lix @F2.0 or 0.024 lux @ F1.2 with AGC on. This was for the 8MP cam. The 5MP version would probably not be much better.

To contrast that with the current Dahua prosumer cam IPC-T5442TM-AS (runs about $155) in a 2.8mm lens has a 1/1.8" 4MP sensor has minimum illumination of 0.0016Lux @ F1.6.

Yes you could use the shelf. Nothing NEEDS to be in the box.

 

[greensleeves]

Thanks everyone! Since the husband cannot be convinced to install (oh well), I've decided to solicit a couple more package quotes while looking into buying something ourselves and then hiring out the install. Sounds like there's no "slam dunk" right now.

There is a "trusted seller" on this forum who can acquire equipment direct? Is this the way to go? I'm also seeing a forum store too.

 

[samplenhold]

There is a "trusted seller" on this forum who can acquire equipment direct

Yes, there is. @EMPIRETECANDY sells Dahua and is the guy I have dealt with exclusively. Just bought yet another cam from him last night.

If all you want is two cams mounted at the pre-wired positions and an NVR, there really is no reason to hire someone to do it. The hardest part of cam installation is running the wires and crimping on the connectors. If that is already done, then drilling a few holes to mount the cam, plugging it in, and then setting up the NVR is fairly simple.

Of course, the actual pre-wired mount may cause you some problems depending on how that is installed. If you take a picture of both of the pre-wired locations, the actual place where the wire is coming out of the house, we could give you insight.

@bigredfish could give you some options on what Dahua NVR to get.

 

[greensleeves]

Thanks again samplenhold! I will get in touch with empiretecandy and bigredfish. Do you know if a Dahua camera exists that's similar to this Ring floodlight cam (all in one)? My neighbor raves about it and we're also in the market for a motion detector floodlight but unsure if we should get a solar powered one separate from the camera. I will see to getting pics behind the prewire plates and maybe shoving either the AT&T box or NVR onto the closet shelf outside of the IT box. Maybe it's easier to get a longer cable for the AT&T box and move that up.

Amazon.com: Ring Floodlight Camera Motion-Activated HD Security Cam Two-Way Talk and Siren Alarm, White: Amazon Devices

Amazon.com: Ring Floodlight Camera Motion-Activated HD Security Cam Two-Way Talk and Siren Alarm, White: Amazon Devices

www.amazon.com

 

[samplenhold]

Do you know if a Dahua camera exists that's similar to this Ring floodlight cam

Personally I do not like the Ring, Nest, Arlo, etc consumer cams at all. I have yet to see a night time image that was good enough to id a face. Lots of neighbors here have those and are always asking me if I have a shot of the perp walking down the street since their cams gave them nothing to use.

Here is an example: Back in April a guy was door checking cars in our neighborhood. He got into lots of cars and took lots of stuff. My Jeep was locked but he ran across my driveway and hid from a passing car. My cam capture below, him crouching next to the white Jeep Grand Cherokee. He then ran across the street into my neighbor's driveway that has a Ring motion spotlight cam, capture enclosed. The guy's face capture is never good enough to use in the Ring video. The colors are all off. My capture was posted on the police's FaceBook page and he was identified, arrested, and prosecuted.



Yes Dahua does have a cam with spot lights. I do not know what it is called as I have not paid attention to that product. It is something I am not interested in. You can search this forum for info on it.

Motion activated lighting has it's own drawbacks when paired with cams. Cams recording in a dark area need time to react to the sudden large increase of light. That includes changing the exposure and resetting the focus. Sometimes this can take a few seconds or more and you may miss important footage.

Post pics of the plates as is and what is inside.

 

[greensleeves]

Wow that's a very clear difference. Which camera is that?

I have read that motion lights are a deterrent, obviously there are many deterrents to consider but this was one we want to have.

 

[samplenhold]

I have read that motion lights are a deterrent

I don't really agree with that statement. It obviously did not faze this guy. In the video that was posted on Ring, he is running towards the driveway, the lights come on, and he continues running. A couple of weeks ago, the guy right next door to the guy with the Ring cam had his tailgate taken off of his pickup truck in his driveway. The perp first parked on the street, a motion spot came on, he then backed up his truck onto the guys driveway and spent the next 5 minutes getting the tailgate off. One of my wide angle overview cams of the intersection caught it, but the scene is too far away to give any info on the guy, just color of the truck and a few other points.

I think that the more light you have, the less of a chance you have of being a victim. But motion lights do not fool anyone. The original idea was that if the light came on, the perp would think that someone has seen them and turned the light on. But they all know now that it is just a motion activated light. I prefer to have good lighting on all night. In the shot from the Ring cam, you can see my house across the street an see how much lighting I have there.

That cam is a Dahua IPC-HDW5231R-ZE. It is a 2MP varifocal turret cam with a 1/2.8" sensor and was the top dog when I got it back in 2018. I was not totally happy with that image of the guy as I felt that it had some motion blur. I have since replaced it with a Dahua IPC-T5442TM-AS fixed lens in 6mm turret. It is a 4MP cam on a 1/1.8" sensor and is now the top dog in the prosumer line. They make a varifocal version (IPC-HDW5445T-ZE) that has just been tested in this forum.

Dahua IPC-HDW5442T-ZE 4MP Varifocal Turret - Night Perfomance testing

All @EMPIRETECANDY kindly provided 1 of these units for testing and I specifically wanted to focus on 1 area, night captures and IR as I know a number of people have been interested in understanding how this compares to the fixed lens variants in this respect and have been wanting a 4MP vari to...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[Holbs]

I installed motion sensor 110v LED lights around the perimeter of my house. I know full well, it may or may not be a deterrent. But sure helps when something amiss goes on and there is light to see during or after the event!

 

[greensleeves]

Thanks samplenhold, I think we will get two of the recommended Dahua cameras! The difference is very clear to us. Is there a difference between fixed lens vs varifocal?

Thanks holbs! Are you satisfied with your motion lights? Are they solar powered or hooked up to an electrical source?

 

[samplenhold]

Is there a difference between fixed lens vs varifocal?

Yes. So for the 5442 turrets (or bullets for that matter) the fixed lens versions come in 2.8mm (very wide angle), 3.6mm (intermediate FOV) and 6mm (a narrower FOV still). So you need to know which FOV is needed to get the view you want. In some cases, even the 6mm is not narrow enough. That is why folks are willing to pay a little more for the varifocal. In the case of the 5442 turrets, the varifocal range is 2.7-12mm. This allows you to get even more zoom than the 6mm. It also allows you to get the exact FOV you want that may not correspond to 2.8, 3.6 of 6mm.

Now the varifocal is a little bit bigger, but you would only notice that if you had the fixed lens sitting next to it for comparison.

The fixed lens versions have a bigger aperture than the varifocal (F1.6 vs. F1.8) and therefore get a little better low light color performance. But again, it is hard to tell the difference at that point without a side-by-side comparison.

The varifocal seems to have a little better depth of field, but the fixed lens depth of field is just fine.

Hope this helps.