Review - Dahua SD49225XA-HNR 2MP 25x Starlight + IR PTZ AI Camera with Deep IVS & SMD Plus

Wildcat_1

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Not an exhaustive post by any means but wanted to try and assist further on this topic.

* Long post incoming *

I’ve been asked a lot and see a lot of posts RE: more megapixels and if higher MP is better when it comes to these cams. Similarly people asking if other cams in the same series offer the same quality of image and performance such as if the 5A825 (new 8MP variant) is as good as others in the series. Therefore wanted to write a quick post here (cross posted in the 5A425 review as well due to both cameras being listed below) to try and help guide people to a better overall experience with their cams.

The key is to remember that you shouldn’t necessarily chase megapixels whether thats on fixed, variable, PTZ even broadcast cameras. Thats not to say that certain applications don’t need, require or benefit from higher MP count but you have to look deeper than that and understand the relationship to sensor, light, SOC and optics etc.

Another key to take away is to remember that not all cams are created equal in this regard and that even in the same camera series these key components and pairings change. These pairings will impact performance and that will play into overall image quality and in some cases make or break an install and its requirements for the set target zone.

For example take a look at all the cam variants below (a number of which we’ve spoken about in this and other threads). While it may appear that certain lens / sensor pairings are the same so when coupling to a similar sensor MP increase would only benefit, the answer is unfortunately it doesn’t.

49225XA-HNR (cam reviewed here) - 1/2.8” 2MP Sensor with 25x F1.6 to F4.4 lens
4GB ROM, 1GB RAM​
Color: 0.005 @ F1.6​
B&W: 0.0005 @ F1.6​
IR Distance: 328’​
IR LED’s: 6​
49425XB-HNR - 1/2.8” 4MP Sensor with 25x F1.6 to F4.0 lens
4GB ROM, 1GB RAM​
Color: 0.005 @ F1.6​
B&W: 0.0005 @ F1.6​
IR Distance: 328’​
IR LED’s: 4​
5A425XA-HNR - 1/1.8” 4MP Sensor with 25x F1.6 to F4.0 lens
4GB ROM, 1GB RAM​
Color: 0.001 @ F1.6​
B&W: 0.0001 @ F1.6​
IR Distance: 492’​
IR LED’s: 4​
5A445XA-HNR - 1/2.8” 4MP Sensor with 45x F1.6 to F4.95 lens
4GB ROM, 1GB RAM​
Color: 0.005 @ F1.6​
B&W: 0.0005 @ F1.6​
IR Distance: 492’​
IR LED’s: 4​
5A825-HNR - 1/1.8” 8MP Sensor with 25x F1.6 to F4.0 lens
8GB ROM, 2GB RAM​
Color: 0.005 @ F1.6​
B&W: 0.0005 @ F1.6​
IR Distance: 492’​
IR LED’s: 4​


Breaking this out further:

Smaller sensors see less light therefore a 1/2.8” will see less than a 1/1.8” and that means conversely that larger sensors capture more light for a set shutter / ISO / aperture. Now this isn’t necessarily a deal breaker by itself BUT then you have to take into account other things, a key one being pixel density. The amount of pixels you are featuring on a sensor. The smaller the sensor, the less space for a given set of pixels and therefore the more pixels you push through a small sensor the more dense it gets.

So what can this lead to, well apart from confusion for a lot of people, if we stick with smaller sensor you find that the more pixels you throw at it then the more you have to mitigate blur and noise in a pixel dense environment using slower shutter speeds. That can work to an extent but can severely ruin a night time capture depending on target you are focused on and necessary shutter speed required to capture it blur free

Another issue with pixel density (the more megapixels we’re cramming into the sensor) is that on smaller sensors you can get light leak between the adjacent pixels which contributes to sensor noise and is amplified or seen more easily in night video again.

You will also see issues with decreased dynamic range which is incredibly important in video and especially when dealing with shadow based areas.

So are larger sensors the way to go and always lead you to success……NO, not by themselves. Again its the pairing of optics (lens), sensor, SOC. While larger sensors combat a number of things listed above and also allow for a much better foreground/background separation in video (great for keeping track of a target with a PTZ) they can still be over crammed by not pairing MP’s to sensor properly. Indeed the best pairing is large sensor to relative MP’s so that you don’t end up overly dense and which will result in way better image quality regardless of aperture. Also remember that most vari-focal lenses have a variable aperture (F-stop) to them meaning which will also regulate and affect light. In these lenses that means you will have a brighter lens at full wide and a darker lens with full zoom (look at the cams above for example). Thats not to say that fixed aperture lenses don’t exist but they are not the norm.

So put this altogether and what does this mean (for those looking for the punchline) well you are ideally looking for a balance as I mentioned. In the case of cameras, the lower the ratio of MP’s to appropriate sensor size will result in a better overall image and certainly result (for the most part) in higher quality, more usable, less noise in night time work. An example of a bad pairing would be the 4K cams we saw early on with 8MP crammed onto a 1/2.8” sensor. The 1/1.8” versions improved that but I can tell you from experience that for 8MP you need a larger sensor still to truly drive great quality across conditions. At a push though 4K/8MP on a 1/1.8” if you are looking at current availability but no smaller.

I couldn’t end this post without also addressing light mitigation in security cams, provided by things like backlight and IR. First off, don’t use backlight, it artificially bumps the image at the cost of noise, stay away from this whenever possible. Daytime you have more to work with so WDR etc can be used there if you must.

Lets quickly look at IR light. While most cams feature IR light you have to look at the distance this is rated for vs your install location. In a number of instances you’ll find people placing cams and assuming the IR will reach further than stated which it can’t. On the flip side you’ll also generally need to shave off about 30’ to 50’ of the stated IR distance in real-world use. Lastly when it comes to PTZ’s with long focal lengths you also need to pay attention to number of IR LED’s and layout. For example looking at the cams above, a number feature 4 IR LED’s but layouts differ by model and you sometimes find that the further distance you are pushing in IR power with fewer IR LED’s can lead to a cone (flashlight beam) effect. This will concentrate light into a spot for more night penetration at the expense of sharp fall off. This can be mitigated (on non pixel dense cams with larger sensors ;)) by adjusting IRIS etc as although noise is increased it can be mitigated. This brings balance to your scene but use sparingly and at the right time because do this with small, pixel dense cams and you end up with a ton of noise that can ruin an image.


* For a great IR setup take a look at the 49225, more IR LED’s, different layout, less stated distance = generally better more balanced coverage at night. The 5A425 also gets away with less IR LED’s due to the larger sensor (more light) and slightly brighter optic pairing but this is the limit you would want to go (from a pairing perspective) for 4MP. Therefore others outside of this on the list generally don’t perform as well and the 8MP would concern me UNLESS there were changes to the sensor and SOC for that cam. *


So back to the cams above. Based on everything I said, what would I recommend, 2 clear winners based on the info and on experience of these cams (except the new 8MP 5A). Personally on the assumption that the 8MP would be using the same SOC, sensor etc (based on specs), I would not expect this to be a high performant PTZ but if I get one will certainly test. My recommendations therefore are:


2MP PTZ - 49225XA-HNR - 1/2.8” 2MP Sensor with 25x F1.6 to F4.4 lens
4MP PTZ - 5A425XA-HNR - 1/1.8” 4MP Sensor with 25x F1.6 to F4.0 lens


The 4MP for this 1/1.8” sensor (in the 5A) is the highest I would want to see in this pairing. The same goes for the 2mp on the 1/2.8”. These 2 cams are really good in these configurations. Conversely, the 5A445 as an example is unfortunately terrible for night vision in my testing and I personally would not recommend that one whereas its small brother, the 5A425, exceptionally well balanced.

While there are some great 8MP cams out there, it again all comes does to the pairing. So while the 1/1.8” pairing on the 7842 Ultra is extremely good, remember that its paired to a bright F1.2 lens which is very different to an 8MP paired to a 1/2.8” with an F1.6 for example. Just some things for all to bear in mind, again, not all cams are created equal and MP to sensor size should be a key consideration amongst others listed above when selecting a cam.

If people find this useful I may just separate this out as a single thread but thought it may be useful to mention the Dahua cams above.

HTH
 

szymonm

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After many tests of different firmware versions (CAM 49425XB-HNR) , I think the customized version(2.800.1341000.0.R, Build Date 2020-03-12) is optimized for object tracking, catches and tracks the target perfectly, unlike the official versions.
 
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djborden

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@Wildcat_1 Outstanding post. You provide this community with excellent / thoughtful help and advice.
 

TJIP

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Having finally slogged through the entire 32 pages of this informative thread, I ordered one of these (4MP version) from Andy's aliexp link last night (think I got the last or next to last one). Initially I was concerned over the firmware issue, but decided it was settled now. Much of my time was spent trying to decide btwn this unit and the two more expensive and more impressive models up the line - the 59 series and new 5A445. The 54A is not available and the 59 series, at nearly 2X the price didn't offer enough improvement. My old 6AE530 died recently and will be replaced by this newer unit. I ordered last night and this morning I got a msg that the camera has already shipped! Bravo Andy.

I use the N52AP nvr and dedicated pc w/ SmartPSS and have always found the combination a bit tricky to properly setup and integrate. I'll probably have questions on that once the camera is installed and running. I have a 180 degree front cam that I want to use as a trigger and several additional cams around the house. Setting IVS/Motion btwn the cams and nvr and getting it all to play well together is occasionally frustrating, so stand by. Thanks to Andy for great service so far and WIldcat for the review info.
Can you tell me what model your 180 degree camera is please? The quality looks fantastic and I am interested in something like this. Thank you!
 

flint350

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Yes, I've been very happy with it. It has 4 X 2 MP sensors that are indistinguishable during daylight, but are apparent at night. They are not a problem for me, just more noticeable. I'll attach an image from last night about 3AM as example. As I write this, Fedex has just dropped off my new SD49425XB, which is intended to provide support to the 180 degree camera. Excellent shipping/delivery from Andy at Empiretec (this will be my 4th cam from him)! This setup will allow me to move my 42212TNI from its current support location to the side of my home and replace an aging and less capable SD-22204TN. I run all cams through a Dahua NVR N52A4P and have a dedicated PC running SmartPSS.
 

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TJIP

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Yes, I've been very happy with it. It has 4 X 2 MP sensors that are indistinguishable during daylight, but are apparent at night. They are not a problem for me, just more noticeable. I'll attach an image from last night about 3AM as example. As I write this, Fedex has just dropped off my new SD49425XB, which is intended to provide support to the 180 degree camera. Excellent shipping/delivery from Andy at Empiretec (this will be my 4th cam from him)! This setup will allow me to move my 42212TNI from its current support location to the side of my home and replace an aging and less capable SD-22204TN. I run all cams through a Dahua NVR N52A4P and have a dedicated PC running SmartPSS.
Thank you again! Appreciate the feedback!!
 

flint350

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So the new cam from Andy arrived (very quick delivery) and I have set it up in my ofc before the arduous task of high level mounting. Everything checked out as promised and the included firmware is the reportedly correct and fully functional one. I see all the menus for DeepIVS, etc and will need to re-read the posts on best setting this up. I may mount it to a corner where it can see both front view and a side view, where I currently have 2 cameras set. I'm curious as to whether this presents issues if presets or motion points are triggered from both views at the same time. Is there a priority setting or does the camera just react to the first one it gets? I'll have to look into this stuff way deeper but looking forward to getting it all working together, as well as playing nice with both the NVR and the dedicated SmartPSS computer at the same time.
 

flint350

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That is my intention, but I'm not sure how that works with corner mounting. It can only monitor the trip/boxes when viewing them directly, so I'm assuming it needs to be triggered by other cameras that monitor the areas that are out of view, causing the PTZ to move to the new area. I'm not wedded to corner mount as I have a separate, smaller camera on the side already, but was considering that a corner would allow the new camera to pivot there for IVS detection and possibly better angle/view/recording, etc. of certain events. I may be making this too complex for my needs, but I like to tinker with problems like this. A couple of years ago I recorded a car thief in the neighborhood and a secondary view might have been even more useful.
 

abolition

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Maybe a question that was asked in the past, but do these cameras exist in black?

I currently have the 5231R-ZE and the junction box in black, and I might be thinking of upgrading if I can replace the existing camera for a PTZ in black.
 

th182

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Maybe a question that was asked in the past, but do these cameras exist in black?

I currently have the 5231R-ZE and the junction box in black, and I might be thinking of upgrading if I can replace the existing camera for a PTZ in black.
Nothing a little spray paint can't fix I haven't painted a PTZ but have painted bullet cams. I found a can of spray on bedliner works great and is durable.

I think it was brought up before that there could be a heat concern with black soaking up all the direct sunlight. I havent had an issue.

IMG_0379.jpg
IMG_0380.jpg


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abolition

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Nothing a little spray paint can't fix I haven't painted a PTZ but have painted bullet cams. I found a can of spray on bedliner works great and is durable.

I think it was brought up before that there could be a heat concern with black soaking up all the direct sunlight. I havent had an issue.

View attachment 61716
View attachment 61717


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That looks neat, I do suck at painting/spraying, but I could consider something like this indeed. The worry is the heat, it will be in direct sunlight for a good 6-7 hours in the summer, the current one is black already so I dont know what the difference could be between black housing, and white housing with an additional layer of black paint. Second worry is the wear and tear, i live on a pier surrounded by a mix of salty and sweet water, so I am also not sure how this will fair long term. The current set is doing fine, but they have only been installed for 6 months now.
 

th182

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That looks neat, I do suck at painting/spraying, but I could consider something like this indeed. The worry is the heat, it will be in direct sunlight for a good 6-7 hours in the summer, the current one is black already so I dont know what the difference could be between black housing, and white housing with an additional layer of black paint. Second worry is the wear and tear, i live on a pier surrounded by a mix of salty and sweet water, so I am also not sure how this will fair long term. The current set is doing fine, but they have only been installed for 6 months now.
Wear and tear was part of the reason for using bedliner spray instead of regular paint. It forms a thick protective coating. It also has a slight texture to it. Not sure how the moving parts would do with salty water hitting them all the time.


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abolition

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Wear and tear was part of the reason for using bedliner spray instead of regular paint. It forms a thick protective coating. It also has a slight texture to it. Not sure how the moving parts would do with salty water hitting them all the time.


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Well water will not hit it directly, it will only be because of high winds. I am attaching some pictures showing the situation.

Also if I am going to paint it, then I will most likely choose a color like the one in the building which is dark greenish.

In red is what I currently see, and in yellow what I would like to see, so about 180 degrees. My only concern is is it will be wide enough for my own door coverage haha. I dont know how to check the current focal point in settings.

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IMG_7686.jpg

IMG_7689.jpg
 

ljw2k

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35 DAYS still very happy with this camera and shown no signs of noise or the PTZ slip like the one I returned to Andy.
The Auto tracking gets better every day and the A1 Algorithms are doing a brilliant job.

Might order another as a spare :)
 

flint350

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I finally finished building my dedicated PC and mounting the new 4MP version of this camera. After re-reading most of the IVS and tracking related posts in this and other threads, I felt reasonably confident that I set it up correctly for my installation. Today I checked playback from last night and this morning and was extremely pleased with the results. A 3AM dog walker entered the intrusion zone and was clearly recorded and tracked very smoothly. During daylight, the mail truck was clearly and smoothly tracked as well as a neighbor crossing the cul de sac to visit another house. Tracking was spot on and zoom was also effective. Mailboxes and a bush or two in line of sight did not seem to affect tracking in any way. A biker was tracked from front of house to far upstreet, past bushes and boxes and never lost. Between the setting suggested here and other threads, I am very confident in this camera's abilities, day and night, using Andy's firmware dated 3/2020.
 

flint350

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For some reason I'm having difficulty exporting clips from the SmartPSS video. I check the timeline for the approx 50-60 sec clip from the video, but the export tries to export the entire video for the day, not just the clip time. I click the scissors at the start and at the end and it looks like it's correct (shows 59 seconds, etc), but the actual export is over 2.5 Gb and not the clip. It may take some time to figure out my mistake but I will post some examples when I get it working.
 
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