Review: EmpireTech IPC-T58IR-ZE-S3 / Dahua 5842T-ZE-S3 - 8MP / 4K Turret Camera

[Wildcat_1]

All

Quick update. I've been working on some of the bugs I've found with this camera and will be documenting all of these to Dahua and @EMPIRETECANDY this week. Specifically 5 I'm tracking right now, all with relatively easy fixes that I've identified.
Also I will be working on another S3 review soon and therefore will hold on overall conclusion post until I've completed the series. I'm also doing some testing with these cams for LPR for you and will report back on my findings on the cam performance in those situations. Stay tuned

 

[lukeeper]

Thank you so much for usefull videos. Few questions:
1: Did you set gain as gain priority mode or manual mode? If manual - shutter should be 0-40?

1.5: In a DAY profile you are using mode - auto for exposure?

2. Gamma 42, contrast 52 and sharpness 40-44 are applied to both day and night?

3. Camera is working on customized scene and you are setting up obly day and night profile?

 

[Wildcat_1]

Thanks for the kind comment @lukeeper
Great questions. Let me expand with some additional answers for you

Q1- ALWAYS Manual Mode and dial in the range for your situation. Personally I don't like to go lower than 1/250 (absolute lowest) during the day. At night I'll go between 1/120 to 1/250 depending on install location and target capture needs
Q1.5 - NOPE, again ALWAYS use Manual Mode
Q2 - This depends on install location and target capture for this series of cams. ALSO depends on which MP can you purchase. for the 4K version (featured in this review), I would 100% keep Sharpness around 42 (split the difference) for day + night and keep Contrast around 52 (maybe 54) for both as well. Gamma is good at 42 during day BUT I've dropped this as low as 32 (yep, that low and even dipped to 28 depending on lighting at location vs vehicle caps) when using this series of cams for other applications like LPR (using the Z4 version of this 4K cam, more on this one later )
Q3 - I use customized and set day and night schedules for month over month / year. This is a HUGE benefit of the v3.0 FW and 5.0 GUI

HTH

Thank you so much for usefull videos. Few questions:
1: Did you set gain as gain priority mode or manual mode? If manual - shutter should be 0-40?

1.5: In a DAY profile you are using mode - auto for exposure?

2. Gamma 42, contrast 52 and sharpness 40-44 are applied to both day and night?

3. Camera is working on customized scene and you are setting up obly day and night profile?

 

[Wildcat_1]

Wanted to provide some updates. Had some issues getting onto the site this week but wanted to post my Tips/Recommendations here (will also post in the initial Post number) here. I am also getting ready to to edit the test for the next S3 camera but have been focused on getting the bugs documented (will post here too) that I've found so far so I can get those (and my proposed fixes) to Dahua ASAP. Lastly I am also going to be posting a separate video (using the S3 cams) for a challenge a couple of people DM'd me about, so watch out for that too.

 

[Wildcat_1]

Tips / Recommendations When Using The S3 Cameras (Listed in My Video too):

• Reduce Gamma to 42.
• Reduce Sharpness to 40 - 44.
• Reduce Exposure Compensation to 20.
• For Night Settings Consider Dropping Gain to Range of 0 - 40 (from 50).
• Increase Contrast to 52.
• At Night, Don't Drop Noise Reduction (2D or 3D) below 36 on These Cameras.
• Turn Off Auto Iris.
• Even Though AcuPick Needs Work, Turn It On To Get IVS + Video Metadata Captures tagged.
• If You Disable AcuPick You Only Get 1 or The Other E.g. IVS, Video Metadata, Face Detect.

Be sure to stay tuned for the challenge Tips & Recommendations where I specifically dive into an area using settings that may surprise a lot of you.

 

[cctvtech]

Hi Wildcat nice videos. I have used the 8MP out in the field and its great at getting faces and plates while zoomed in on a road (during the day). It gets them twice as far as the 4MP I also have on another site (eg. 600+ vehicles before 10am, 2000 human detections by midday). When I left it full screen it was catching cars passing on the main road and within 1 hour I had 60 pages of vehicles (disabled that quickly as I only needed the side road). It is very accurate though, better than expected. Eg. 150 feet away it will show me a white car in search result. I find the 8MP is not good for night though so I install it primarily for Daytime along with various model 4MP cameras for night.

So definitely the 8MP is best for daytime plates (non searchable) and faces with Metadata (when searching faces it shows results from face detection enabled channels plus Metadata enabled channels with face detect enabled). In fact on the XI series you can enable Metadata on a non AI camera and by default Face Detection is enabled in that "Metadata by Recorder" setting (can be disabled for low res cameras). XI lets you do 8 channels of AI By recorder (eg. 2x face recognition and 6 metadata, or 8 face recognition, etc. any combination). Im doing Face Recognition at various stores now using the 5442 ZE on the EI series NVR. In a couple cases I am using NON AI Cameras and Face Detection by Recorder. It all works much better than it did a few years ago. I tested Face Recognition alerts with custom databases and it worked very accurate at 80% setting even with low res faces in the databases.

XI series still has no Acupick in the web service though, waiting patiently as nobody will use a 2U rackmount on their desk to setup and use Acupick (all rack mounted or wall mounted locked away in IT rooms). It has to work over the Network.

That said, since you have Dahua's ear can you please ask them to make a LITE version of the camera webservice as that new animated one crashes the phone which is the only way to setup the cameras in many cases when dealing with big buildings and locked down IT departments. Even my faster PC has issues with it when setting up at home. Maybe they can use a toggle switch to LEGACY mode. As techs we dont need fancy animations. Thanks. Appreciated if possible.

 

[steve1225]

If You Disable AcuPick You Only Get 1 or The Other E.g. IVS, Video Metadata, Face Detect.

If You disable AcuPick and go into straight Video Metadata on 5442-S3, You have triple: Video Metadata, Face Detect (with face snapshots) and car plates snapshots (but not plate numbers - this can be only done on 7xx2-X)... Very functional for street / outside plot cams...

If You want full Video Metadata (with Face & Plate snapshots, without AcuPick) & IVS on public street cams and use Dahua 5xxx-EI NVR, You can disable AcuPick on NVR and use IVS done on recorder (up to 4 channels) for those street cams. In this configuration the rest cams (above 4) can have AcuPick (IVS + mini VMD) enabled and mini VMD with human attributes will work.

Disabling AcuPick on NVR simply disable base AcuPick 1.0 functionality (searching people/cars by IMAGE) not Video Metadata & human/cars attributes part (searching people/cars by attributes)..

There is third variant where You run full Video Metadata (with face & plate snapshots) on 5442-S3 cam, disable AcuPick on NVR and run Face Recognition (up to 8 cams) on 5xxx-EI NVR...

 

[steve1225]

So definitely the 8MP is best for daytime plates (non searchable) and faces with Metadata (when searching faces it shows results from face detection

You can try 7442-X..
It have full ANPR in Video MetaData mode (plates are OCR & searchable)..
Also have different video processing - I found that on 7442 I can setup low gain (like 30 max 40 for low noise) with short shutter for night mode & then do SSA/WDR which on 7442 will do second level gain, much better that 5442. 7442 works much better for motion at night conditions.

7442 (but only 4mpx version) have also time division exposure technology - which joins static/slow moving and fast moving objects from different shutter exposures.. something like WDR/HDR for motion...

XI series still has no Acupick in the web service though, waiting patiently as nobody will use a 2U rackmount on their desk to setup and use Acupick (all rack mounted or wall mounted locked away in IT rooms). It has to work over the Network.

Also wait for AcuPick 2.0 firmware for 6xx-XI...
Dahua promised that 6xx-XI will have option to do AcuPick on recorder & Face Detection/Recognition for AcuPick cams..
Release date for 6xx-XI promised by Dahua in AcuPick 2.0 presentation was July 2024.
But this didn't materialized.

ps. you can use HDMI over CAT5 extenders with KVM functions (transfer USB mouse back to transceiver)...

 

[cpd5215]

If You disable AcuPick and go into straight Video Metadata on 5442-S3, You have triple: Video Metadata, Face Detect (with face snapshots) and car plates snapshots (but not plate numbers - this can be only done on 7xx2-X)... Very functional for street / outside plot cams...

If You want full Video Metadata (with Face & Plate snapshots, without AcuPick) & IVS on public street cams and use Dahua 5xxx-EI NVR, You can disable AcuPick on NVR and use IVS done on recorder (up to 4 channels) for those street cams. In this configuration the rest cams (above 4) can have AcuPick (IVS + mini VMD) enabled and mini VMD with human attributes will work.

Disabling AcuPick on NVR simply disable base AcuPick 1.0 functionality (searching people/cars by IMAGE) not Video Metadata & human/cars attributes part (searching people/cars by attributes)..

There is third variant where You run full Video Metadata (with face & plate snapshots) on 5442-S3 cam, disable AcuPick on NVR and run Face Recognition (up to 8 cams) on 5xxx-EI NVR...

You seem to have a very good working knowledge of Metadata and AcuPick so I figured I would ask you. I bought a NVR8CH-8P-2AI which I believe is 5 series??? It has AcuPick. I also have several 5442-S3 cams and Z4-S3's. With that said, with the settings I have enabled (see screenshots) I have 3 questions.

1.) When I search the NVR for "Face detection", it produces no results. I would like the 5442 by my front door to detect faces and then those captures by easily searched by the NVR. I dont necessarily need this ability on the rest of my cams. I use IVS with people, vehicle, and animal detection on ALL cams (setup on cam itself) as of now which works really well. It appears in the NVR GUI that Face Detection is turned on.

2.) I have one interior cam, IP2M-841 connected to NVR via WIFI that I have dumb motion detection enabled only when we go to bed. Is there anyway for the NVR to impose SMD on this cam since the cam just does all motion and I get a lot of false triggers in the middle of the night. I cant seem to figure this out and maybe it has something to do with AcuPick enabled on NVR ( I really like the power of AcuPick).

3.) lastly, I think I read in the NVR manual but cant find it now, but I thought there was the abilty to report "false" images or somehting like that to the NVR database when AcuPick or metadata was captured and it was the "wrong" item in an effort to improve the false triggers. This is not a big deal but thought I would give it a whirl and see if it helped.

Thanks again. I enjoy reading you and others posts with extensive knowledge of these NVRs and cams.

 

[steve1225]

You seem to have a very good working knowledge of Metadata and AcuPick so I figured I would ask you. I bought a NVR8CH-8P-2AI which I believe is 5 series??? It has AcuPick. I also have several 5442-S3 cams and Z4-S3's. With that said, with the settings I have enabled (see screenshots) I have 3 questions.

it's 5208-8P-EI...

1.) When I search the NVR for "Face detection", it produces no results. I would like the 5442 by my front door to detect faces and then those captures by easily searched by the NVR. I dont necessarily need this ability on the rest of my cams. I use IVS with people, vehicle, and animal detection on ALL cams (setup on cam itself) as of now which works really well. It appears in the NVR GUI that Face Detection is turned on.

NVR allows to setup all AI options done on cam (IVS, VideoMetaData, Face Detection, Face Recognition) without checking which AI function is selected on Smart Plan on that camera. But this don't mean that AI function will work - Smart Plan selection done on camera is valid.

If You want Face Detection on 5xxx-S3 camera, then the best solution is disable AcuPick on that camera and select & configure Video Metadata on that camera. You will get human/cars detection with attributes (age/sex/colors) plus face detection & car plates snapshots.. You will be able to browse faces or humans or cars in NVR interface (AI search -> Face detection & AI search -> Human detection & AI search -> motor vehicle detection)..

You will lose IVS functionality on that camera.

If You need IVS for that cam, You must disable AcuPick on NVR side (AI settings -> Smart Plan -> Recorder tab -> AI Mode).
In that case You will lose ability to search people / cars by IMAGE (plus AI search -> AcuPick menu) but all functionality from Video Meta Data (human / face / motor search by attributes described above) will be working.

After reboot You will get ability to configure IVS by 'AI on recorder' for that channel (configuration only by NVR interface).

2.) I have one interior cam, IP2M-841 connected to NVR via WIFI that I have dumb motion detection enabled only when we go to bed. Is there anyway for the NVR to impose SMD on this cam since the cam just does all motion and I get a lot of false triggers in the middle of the night. I cant seem to figure this out and maybe it has something to do with AcuPick enabled on NVR ( I really like the power of AcuPick).

the same - You must disable AcuPick on recorder.
then You will have ability to run SMD (8 channels) / IVS (4) / Face Detection (2) &recognition (8 channels if face detection or full video meta data is enabled on cam) by 'AI on recorder'.

AcuPick on recorder and all other AI modes on recorder don't work together on 5xxx-EI.
For that You need higher line of NVR (6xx-XI)..

3.) lastly, I think I read in the NVR manual but cant find it now, but I thought there was the abilty to report "false" images or somehting like that to the NVR database when AcuPick or metadata was captured and it was the "wrong" item in an effort to improve the false triggers. This is not a big deal but thought I would give it a whirl and see if it helped.

this is 5xxx-S3 function on latest firmware.
You will find 'self lerning' option in global configuration in IVS settings (both on NVR or cam).
After enabling there will be option for editing experience database, where You can upload 'false positives' (cutted images of things which creates false positives - like tress etc)..

You can also restrict area (in video frame) in Video Meta Data configuration for detection of people / cars / non motor vehicles to exclude problematic frame fragment (like trees or public street with high cars traffic).

 

[cpd5215]

it's 5208-8P-EI...




NVR allows to setup all AI options done on cam (IVS, VideoMetaData, Face Detection, Face Recognition) without checking which AI function is selected on Smart Plan on that camera. But this don't mean that AI function will work - Smart Plan selection done on camera is valid.

If You want Face Detection on 5xxx-S3 camera, then the best solution is disable AcuPick on that camera and select & configure Video Metadata on that camera. You will get human/cars detection with attributes (age/sex/colors) plus face detection & car plates snapshots.. You will be able to browse faces or humans or cars in NVR interface (AI search -> Face detection & AI search -> Human detection & AI search -> motor vehicle detection)..

You will lose IVS functionality on that camera.

If You need IVS for that cam, You must disable AcuPick on NVR side (AI settings -> Smart Plan -> Recorder tab -> AI Mode).
In that case You will lose ability to search people / cars by IMAGE (plus AI search -> AcuPick menu) but all functionality from Video Meta Data (human / face / motor search by attributes described above) will be working.

After reboot You will get ability to configure IVS by 'AI on recorder' for that channel (configuration only by NVR interface).



the same - You must disable AcuPick on recorder.
then You will have ability to run SMD (8 channels) / IVS (4) / Face Detection (2) &recognition (8 channels if face detection or full video meta data is enabled on cam) by 'AI on recorder'.

AcuPick on recorder and all other AI modes on recorder don't work together on 5xxx-EI.
For that You need higher line of NVR (6xx-XI)..



this is 5xxx-S3 function on latest firmware.
You will find 'self lerning' option in global configuration in IVS settings (both on NVR or cam).
After enabling there will be option for editing experience database, where You can upload 'false positives' (cutted images of things which creates false positives - like tress etc)..

You can also restrict area (in video frame) in Video Meta Data configuration for detection of people / cars / non motor vehicles to exclude problematic frame fragment (like trees or public street with high cars traffic).

Well, shit I figured you would know one or two of these but not all three. LOL. Thanks a lot for the detailed explanation of all of these items. That will help me a lot.

 

[bigredfish]

I’ll second the use of Metadata on the S3s. I have it enabled on my close up street view and am able to get face detection, human, vehicle, and non vehicle results on my older 5216-16p-4Ks2E NVR. All of that on a single camera even using an older NVR is quite powerful

 

[steve1225]

Well, shit I figured you would know one or two of these but not all three. LOL. Thanks a lot for the detailed explanation of all of these items. That will help me a lot.

heh..
I do all those things on all installed by me systems..
full cars / plates / human / faces database with attributes for dedicated street / gate cams (AcuPick disabled & full version of Video MetaData done on camera) plus cars / human database & IVS for inside plot / house cams (AcuPick enabled with mini IVS & mini Video MetaData)..

one / two 5442-Z4 (or 7442-Z4) zoomed cams dedicated for street / gate can generate thousands of cars / humans records per day..

 

[cpd5215]

heh..
I do all those things on all installed by me systems..
full cars / plates / human / faces database with attributes for dedicated street / gate cams (AcuPick disabled & full version of Video MetaData done on camera) plus cars / human database & IVS for inside plot / house cams (AcuPick enabled with mini IVS & mini Video MetaData)..

one / two 5442-Z4 (or 7442-Z4) zoomed cams dedicated for street / gate can generate thousands of cars / humans records per day..

Just so I understand this correctly, you can enable or disable AcuPick per individual camera and not just on for ALL cams connected to NVR or all off? Also what’s “mini IVS”. Lol. I’m sure I’ll recognize what you mean once you explain it a little bit. Thank you.