Zmodo / Funlux suck how they manipulate the game.

[mat200]

Hi,

It is important to share how some companies go out of their way to deceive and manipulate potential customers to buy crappy products.

A great example of one such company are those behind Zmodo / Funlux brands.

They imho are one of the worst.

Here I illustrate a prime example of them astroturfing in another forum.

Notice the new account created the same month, only a week before the first post. Notice the number of posts this account has done. Notice the wording they used.

This is why you want to avoid crappy companies selling crappy products. I'll add more below.

 

[mat200]

Here are my notes from that forum regarding Zmodo, Funlux, as well as Annke / Sannce
( note so far there has been one exception for Annke branded cameras - because that one camera is a quality Hikvision OEM product )

How does this .. compare to a zmodo / annke / sannce / funlux "POE" system?:
All of those brands seem to like to deceive customers into thinking they are selling an affordable PoE security camera system, when in fact the system is NOT PoE and does not meet any PoE standards and is not compatible with IP cameras. Those are proprietary systems which once you read more about you will find they are back pedaling and then calling them "sPOE" - what they call simplified POE. They are clearly being fraudulent, thus I recommend avoiding them and getting something which meets PoE standards and allows you to plug in ONVIF spec cameras to the system.
Examples of fraudulent misrepresentation and/or deceptive practices:

• Claiming NVR and cameras are POE, when it is not - look for terms like sPoE and simplified PoE.
• Claiming system is 1080p, when the NVR is capable of displaying to a 1080p monitor/TV but only able to handle 720p cameras.
• Claiming system is 1080p, upon closer look you notice "1080p lite" - which does not meet 1080p standards. Typically look for less fps. ( frames per second )
• Inferring that the system is 1080p by using the term 1080N, noting that 1080N = 960×1080=1036800 pixels vs. 720p = 1280x720 = 921600 vs 1080p = 1920x1080 = 2073600
• Claiming cameras are IP cameras, but you will notice that the cameras only work with their branded "NVR", and may in fact be analog cameras for all we know.
• Claiming system is digital, using banking level security, and secure vs an analog system which is not secure. Absolute BS, from companies which will not hire enough talented software engineers.
• Astroturfing - zmodo / funlux / Annke practices astroturfing in forums like SlickDeals - posting positive comments and thumbs up.

Ref: ANNKE 1080P 8CH HD POE Security Camera System is best for home safety
Ref: Whats 1080N resolution for DVRs?

sPoE, simplified PoE - certainly these vendors would not lie to me to make more sales, so it must be some version of PoE.
Welcome to the con job, anything to separate your money from you by showing you a crazy low price for what may appear to be something better.
The fact is that those using these terms are being deceptive and fraudulent. Since 1999 there have been standards for PoE, and prior to that standards for Ethernet over twisted pairs. While it is possible to have legacy ( pre-standard ) PoE implementations, any new products produced which claim to be PoE should meet at least one PoE spec, as well as ethernet specs. When this is not the case, and yet those terms are used - then clearly there is fraudulent and deceptive practices going on.
Example:
Ethernet over twisted pair - specifies 2 pairs for transmission of data ( 10BaseT, 100BaseT,.. ) - vs - zmodo's "sPoE" which uses only 1 pair for this ( using 1 pair for power ).
Zmodo includes cables in their kits with only 4 wires ( 2 pairs ) vs cat5/cat5e/cat6 which have 8 wires ( 4 twisted pairs ). The only similarity that zmodo retains is the RJ45 jack - and using an RJ45 jack does not make it ethernet, nor PoE compliant. In fact you can implement the zmodo cable with just plain old telephone cables - yes that is correct, you can use 4 wire phone cable, that is 2 pairs. This is what zmodo does in effect.
Here is a video which clearly shows the cameras using only 4 wires - 2 for power, 2 for signal - thus it does not meet ethernet specs for twisted pair, also note color coding does not meet the spec either.

 

[TonyR]

Zmodo ignored 3 emails from me requesting on behalf of a client an RMA for a bad cam that failed during year 2 of a 3 year warranty. You can offer a 10 year warranty or promise the moon but if you ignore all requests for service or support then your co. makes money BUT...no repeat customer base! I tell everyone to avoid Zmodo like the plague because they offer a lousy product at a mediocre price and back it up with non-existent customer service...the trifecta of bad business practice!

 

[looney2ns]

I couldn't understand the guy in the video, what did he say was the cause of the corrosion? Crappy waterproof parts?

I suspect (hope) that the companies that bailed on the NRA will feel the burn.

 

[mat200]

FYI - additional reference info on the SD forum of zmodo / funlux astroturfing.

Slickdeals: The Best Deals, Coupons, Promo Codes & Discounts ( sd removed the above reference - just suspect they do not want members and readers to know how the scores are being manipulated )

 

[mat200]

You can see the account created to manipulate and astroturf.

There are many account also created to just up vote zmodo / funlux and those do not engage in commentary, just tilting the score to increase sales.

 

[mat200]

Another example, this time the account has been sitting around for a number of months before astroturfing.

Notice, one thumb up, one positive planted comment.




suspected content:

 

[bokenrosie]

I was a sucker who bought Zmodo. It is what got me into the premise of home monitoring and it served the purpose of giving my wife some comfort at a time when some criminals were working our town and clogging sinks to flood house as a calling card.

When I replaced Zmodo with LTS NVR I found that the wires that Zmodo used only had 4 connectors so no POE with the replacement cameras.

Stay away from Zmodo. They replaced one camera and one NVR before system was past the one year warranty. It's all dead shortly after that.

 

[pozzello]

while I have no experience with Zmodo/Funlux or their tactics, I do know for a fact that 'real' ethernet at 10 or 100mbps runs over only 2 pairs (4 wires), including 'real' (mode A) PoE...

perhaps they are referring to PASSIVE PoE (apply power to the wire without any sort of testing or negotiation) as 'simplified'...

 

[TonyR]

....at a time when some criminals were working our town and clogging sinks to flood house as a calling card.

Reminds me of the Wet Bandits in "Home Alone"...."Harry, its' our calling card" :

 

[TonyR]

while I have no experience with Zmodo/Funlux or their tactics, I do know for a fact that 'real' ethernet at 10 or 100mbps runs over only 2 pairs (4 wires), including 'real' (mode A) PoE...

perhaps they are referring to PASSIVE PoE (apply power to the wire without any sort of testing or negotiation) as 'simplified'...

Whatever Zmodo's reason for calling it "sPOE" or "Simplified POE" is, it is marketing deception by doing so. They are preying on the misunderstanding and naivete of the technology to newcomers by throwing around some valid words like "POE". The uninformed key in on those terms that they have heard and make some unfounded assumptions. IMO, the only safe assumption one can make when dealing with Zmodo is that they are schemers and liars.

The uncolored conductors in the bottom RJ-45 are not present in the connector, they are absent, therefore, only 4 wires are present. This means 1 pair, not 2, for data so it's not a differential signal and therefore is slower and more prone to noise than "real" Ethernet.

 

[bokenrosie]

"deceptive marketing", inferior hardware, weak support after the sale. All the hallmarks of Zmodo and why I would never buy anything with their name on it again. Call it whatever we want it's still junk and wasted money IMHO.

Sure wish I'd known about this site before...

 

[pozzello]

"This means 1 pair, not 2, for data so it's not a differential signal and therefore is slower and more prone to noise than "real" Ethernet."

10/100 and 802.3a/t PoE Ethernet mode A run over the same two pairs of wires.
Only 4 wires (2 pairs) are used for 'real' 10/100 ethernet, with or without PoE.

The uncolored connectors are only used for gigabit Ethernet or mode B 802.3ax PoE.

And there's nothing 'fake' about passive PoE. Sure, it's not 802.3 compliant, but it can and does work,
whatever they might call it. Sure it's marketing to give it a fancy name like PoES, but as long as they aren't claiming it's 802.3 compliant when it's not, then it's a 'buyer beware' thing...

I'm not defending Zmodo. I have zero experience with their products. I do know about networking, however...

 

[mat200]

while I have no experience with Zmodo/Funlux or their tactics, I do know for a fact that 'real' ethernet at 10 or 100mbps runs over only 2 pairs (4 wires), including 'real' (mode A) PoE...

perhaps they are referring to PASSIVE PoE (apply power to the wire without any sort of testing or negotiation) as 'simplified'...

They're gaming the system and lying to get sales.

I have NEVER seen a twisted pair ethernet cable with just ONE pair. Nor have I seen an ethernet jack with just one pair.

 

[TonyR]

"This means 1 pair, not 2, for data so it's not a differential signal and therefore is slower and more prone to noise than "real" Ethernet.".....
I'm not defending Zmodo. I have zero experience with their products. I do know about networking, however...

Not sure what you are saying here. You quote my "This means 1 pair, not 2, for data so it's not a differential signal and therefore is slower and more prone to noise than "real" Ethernet.".....and then state "I'm not defending Zmodo. ....I do know about networking, however."

Are you're saying that one can, in fact, comply with 100BASE-TX and perform full duplex (transmit and receive at the same time), low-interference signaling on 1 pair (1 wire is transmit, 1 wire is receive) at 100 Mbps for a minimum of 100 meters / 328 feet?

"And there's nothing 'fake' about passive PoE"......who said there was ? Other than the fact that Zmodo can't even use pins 4/5 & 7/8 as in the majority of passive POE applications?

 

[pozzello]

4 wires is two pairs and that's all that 10 or 100mbs ethernet uses or needs, with or without PoE.

I have no idea where you get the idea that 4 wires means only 1 pair used for data. that's just wrong.

 

[uniquename]

sd removed the above reference - just suspect they do not want members and readers to know how the scores are being manipulated

Scratch that...I see what happened. They didn't "hide" for the reason you think. It was in the attempt to not have the community get a shilled deal essentially.

I happen to know that forum You absolutely should mod alert shills!

If you feel that hasn't been working, just PM me there.

 

[pozzello]

Thinking about it some more, I realize Zmodo's 'PoES' or 'simplified' PoE must be that they support only the MODE A part of 802.3af/at spec.
PoE spec states compliant devices that accept PoE power should accept either Mode A or Mode B input.
(most switches provide power in Mode A over the 123 & 6 wires, the SAME wires used for 10/100 data).
Mode B (as provided by some mid-span ethernet switches or injectors) would use those other missing 4 wires,
so since they only have 4 wires (cost-cutting for sure!), they can't claim 802.3 compliance (even tho it does follow the the Mode A part).

I don't have one to play with and verify this, so they may well only support passive PoE,
but that doesn't change the fact that it can and does work on the same 4 wires used for 10/100 data...

 

[mat200]

Thinking about it some more, I realize Zmodo's 'PoES' or 'simplified' PoE must be that they support only the MODE A part of 802.3af/at spec.
PoE spec states compliant devices that accept PoE power should accept either Mode A or Mode B input.
(most switches provide power in Mode A over the 123 & 6 wires, the SAME wires used for 10/100 data).
Mode B (as provided by some mid-span ethernet switches or injectors) would use those other missing 4 wires,
so since they only have 4 wires (cost-cutting for sure!), they can't claim 802.3 compliance (even tho it does follow the the Mode A part).

I don't have one to play with and verify this, so they may well only support passive PoE,
but that doesn't change the fact that it can and does work on the same 4 wires used for 10/100 data...

HI @pozzello

They are not following ANY PoE standard - their products are not compatible with any PoE products. They're only using the term PoE in a deceptive way to increase sales and sucker consumers into thinking they got a good deal on a PoE product.

In many of their ads they have had on Amazon - they would not mention even the simplified term in the top part of the ad ( "above the fold" in newspaper terms ).

 

[pozzello]

I agree that their SPoE strategy & marketing is lame and preys on folks who don't know any better,
attempting to 'lock' them into their ecosystem to sell more of their products.
(using a microUSB connector for data & power, as an example)

quoted from OP: "zmodo's "sPoE" which uses only 1 pair for this ( using 1 pair for power )."

My only point in commenting on this thread at all was to correct the notion that having only 4 wires
must mean that one pair is used for 10/100mbs data while the other pair is used for power.

That's just not how it works, 10/100 data uses 4 wires.
Power can (optionally) also be sent over the SAME 4 wires,
either adhering to the 802.3at/f standard or not (passive).

Zomodo/Funlux has not magically 'cheapened' ethernet to run on a single pair for data. No, they have not.