New DYI guy with new project

[luisrodz]

Hi,

I've been browsing your forum for a while looking for ideas for my new built house. I did some pre-wiring before the drywall was placed trying to avoid some headaches after moving in. Is one-story house with a bonus room upstairs (does this make it a two-story house?)

Well, I was thinking on Home Automation, Surveillance and Alarm System. So, I've been looking for options but as so many of you have mentioned, there's no perfect system. You have to integrate multiple.

I was have dome some research but still have some doubts and concerns about integration. At some point I was even thinking about Control 4, but since it has to be thru a dealer, I changed my mind. I was attracted to it since it's versatility and been the most affordable compared with other brands.

Since I decided to DYI, I've been searching for a while. I did pre-wire for Surveillance, Video Distribution and Sound. I didn't for Alarm system, but I figured that I can use wireless or hybrid without the hassle of a lot of re-wiring.

I'm thinking about starting the project but prioritizing based on budget and the W.I.F.E factor. LoL.

After expending around 1K pre-wiring, I thought that the first part should be alarm and surveillance. I've been looking at Hicvision and Dahua. I have several questions and I’m going to list them. I really don’t expect for someone to just jump on and answer all, but I’ll appreciate your help. It seems that this is a good forum that have a lot of people willing to help.

1. My main concern is security. I really don’t want to expose myself to the internet.
2. I don’t mind buying from Grey Market. I have done it before and it seems that you already have found a trustable resource.
3. I don’t know which brand should I use on alarm system. I want it to be DYI, not attached to a monthly contract and also be able to hook it to my surveillance system.
4. I would also like to integrate both, Surveillance and Alarm to my Video Distribution. As I mentioned at the beginning, I’m willing to do this into small projects. I know, it’s not small, but I want to do it so later on, I don’t have to go back and change things.
5. Maybe, later I will add some more.

I’ll appreciate your help.

luisrodz

PS> I have a picture of my floor plan in case it's needed.

 

[mat200]

Welcome Luis,

You may have already seen the following notes, so this probably will be helpful for those following this thread who have not yet seen them:
IPCamTalk WiKi | IP Cam Talk

 

[luisrodz]

Welcome Luis,

You may have already seen the following notes, so this probably will be helpful for those following this thread who have not yet seen them:
IPCamTalk WiKi | IP Cam Talk

Thank you for your response. I did look at Blue Iris but was thinking about NVR already built. Definitely, good information.


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[looney2ns]

Be sure to check out the Alarm/Homeautomation area of this forum.

 

[luisrodz]

Be sure to check out the Alarm/Homeautomation area of this forum.

I will. I have seen DSC doing a pretty good job with integration, but don’t know if it could be triggered by IP cams.

I just decided that I’m doing the alarm project, then IP cams. Looking forward to make a decision in a couple of weeks.


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[tangent]

I was have dome some research but still have some doubts and concerns about integration. At some point I was even thinking about Control 4, but since it has to be thru a dealer, I changed my mind. I was attracted to it since it's versatility and been the most affordable compared with other brands.

Since I decided to DYI, I've been searching for a while. I did pre-wire for Surveillance, Video Distribution and Sound. I didn't for Alarm system, but I figured that I can use wireless or hybrid without the hassle of a lot of re-wiring.

I'm thinking about starting the project but prioritizing based on budget and the W.I.F.E factor. LoL.

After expending around 1K pre-wiring, I thought that the first part should be alarm and surveillance. I've been looking at Hicvision and Dahua. I have several questions and I’m going to list them. I really don’t expect for someone to just jump on and answer all, but I’ll appreciate your help. It seems that this is a good forum that have a lot of people willing to help.

1. My main concern is security. I really don’t want to expose myself to the internet.
2. I don’t mind buying from Grey Market. I have done it before and it seems that you already have found a trustable resource.
3. I don’t know which brand should I use on alarm system. I want it to be DYI, not attached to a monthly contract and also be able to hook it to my surveillance system.
4. I would also like to integrate both, Surveillance and Alarm to my Video Distribution. As I mentioned at the beginning, I’m willing to do this into small projects. I know, it’s not small, but I want to do it so later on, I don’t have to go back and change things.
5. Maybe, later I will add some more.

It's a matter of what kind of integration you expect to achieve and what you want to spend.

I always prefer hardwired alarms, they're more reliable and it's nice to have concealed sensors. A hybrid alarm with mostly wireless sensors does require a few wires for power, communications, siren, and keypads. Your house sounds like what is sometimes referred to as 1.5 story. Without seeing a floor plan it's hard to say how hard it would be to get wire the places you need. What's your attic space like?

DSC and Honeywell are good options for the alarm. GE is a decent option too. If integration (eg. control HA from alarm keypad) is important enough to you, you might want to consider ELK. Monitored alarms are more useful than self monitoring, you can get monitoring without contract for $10-20/mo.

As for cameras, the first step is figuring out how useful your pre-wiring will be.

 

[luisrodz]

It's a matter of what kind of integration you expect to achieve.

I always prefer hardwired alarms, they're more reliable and it's nice to have concealed sensors. A hybrid alarm with mostly wireless sensors does require a few wires for power, communications, siren, and keypads. Your house sounds like what is sometimes referred to as 1.5 story. Without seeing a floor plan it's hard to say how hard it would be to get wire the places you need. What's your attic space like?

DSC and Honeywell are good options for the alarm. GE is a decent option too. If integration (eg. control HA from alarm keypad) is important enough to you, you might want to consider ELK. Monitored alarms are more useful than self monitoring, you can get monitoring without contract for $10-20/mo.

As for cameras, the first step is figuring out how useful your pre-wiring will be.

Thank you tangent for your reply.

Since the drywall is already done, it's going to be hard to wire specially for door/window sensors. For this reason I'm currently looking to hybrid. I'm providing my wiring setup. Let me know what you think about it.



This first image is what I did for Audio and Video Distribution.



This one shows the wiring for Surveillance that I already prewired. I also draw the angles for the cameras, but I'm not sure if it's they way should be.

I have been looking at DSC and Honeywell but have not decided yet. Open to new recommendations.

 

[tangent]

This first image is what I did for Audio and Video Distribution.
This one shows the wiring for Surveillance that I already prewired.

So are in wall and in-ceiling speakers already installed or just prewired? Did you home run ALL of the audio cables to your media rack or were you planning on an AVR in certain rooms?

I don't know what rooms have high ceilings or what the roof/truss structure looks like, but it looks like you probably have a reasonably accessible attic over most of the house. I'd bet if you wanted to it wouldn't be that hard to hardwire certain doors. What kind of insulation is in the walls and attic? Have you been up in the attic?

For wireless alarm sensors for doors and windows, there are smaller more compact models like this: Versa: Wireless Home Security Sensors (HONEYWEll-DSC-2GIG-GE-HAI)
If home automation is a priority, use wired motion sensors over wireless where ever you can.

 

[luisrodz]

So are in wall and in-ceiling speakers already installed or just prewired? Did you home run ALL of the audio cables to your media rack or were you planning on an AVR in certain rooms?

I don't know what rooms have high ceilings or what the roof/truss structure looks like, but it looks like you probably have a reasonably accessible attic over most of the house. I'd bet if you wanted to it wouldn't be that hard to hardwire certain doors. What kind of insulation is in the walls and attic? Have you been up in the attic?

For wireless alarm sensors for doors and windows, there are smaller more compact models like this: Versa: Wireless Home Security Sensors (HONEYWEll-DSC-2GIG-GE-HAI)
If home automation is a priority, use wired motion sensors over wireless where ever you can.

tangent,

Thank you for your response and interest in helping. FYI, this is a new construction and I have not move in yet. I did the pre-wiring during building phase. So, this is just pre-wire; no installation yet.

All wires are centralized on a rack that is going to be localized in the Bonus Room (Second Floor) - I hope my knees last long enough to take care of this... LOL. The plan is to hace a centralized control room for AV, but the alarm system could be place somewhere else. My biggest problem right now is that the bonus room is in top of the Great room and is going to be kind of difficult to run wire back there. I think I can do some wiring for the sensors, but some would have to be wireless.

I do have attic entrance for all the rooms that are not covered with the bonus room as well as the bonus room. Regarding the insulation, I'm pretty sure that the only wall that have insulations are the outside walls. I have not been into the attic yet, but I think is the loose one.

Once again, thank you for your help.

 

[tangent]

Hopefully you took lots of pictures before the drywall went up.

I haven't looked at high end multi room audio recently, but if you install all of the speakers you wired for in the rooms with 5.1 that could use 3 audio video receivers and would take up A LOT of space in your media rack. This is why I was wondering if you were planning on putting an AVR in each of these rooms, which might be a little more practical. You might need to duct some cooling into that closet.

How did you prewire for the cameras? Did you install junction boxes at locations you want cams or are the wires just in the wall?

 

[luisrodz]

Hopefully you took lots of pictures before the drywall went up.

I haven't looked at high end multi room audio recently, but if you install all of the speakers you wired for in the rooms with 5.1 that could use 3 audio video receivers and would take up A LOT of space in your media rack. This is why I was wondering if you were planning on putting an AVR in each of these rooms, which might be a little more practical. You might need to duct some cooling into that closet.

How did you prewire for the cameras? Did you install junction boxes at locations you want cams or are the wires just in the wall?

Yes I did take a lot of pictures regarding the wiring. Regarding the media rack, it is going to be concealed in the Great Room closet and if it's necessary, I can run a cooling duct to the closet.

The wiring for the cameras was done with Cat6 and I didn't install any junction boxes. Outdoor places are cables handing on the soffit or walls and indoor are hidden behind the wall/roof waiting to be pulled. I though I was doing right with the prewire and now I figure that I missed a lot of things. I wanted to be future proof, but now I realize that I did a mediocre job.

 

[tangent]

Yes I did take a lot of pictures regarding the wiring. Regarding the media rack, it is going to be concealed in the Great Room closet and if it's necessary, I can run a cooling duct to the closet.

The wiring for the cameras was done with Cat6 and I didn't install any junction boxes. Outdoor places are cables handing on the soffit or walls and indoor are hidden behind the wall/roof waiting to be pulled. I though I was doing right with the prewire and now I figure that I missed a lot of things. I wanted to be future proof, but now I realize that I did a mediocre job.

That's fine, you don't need junction boxes. Regarding cameras, a common mistake is mounting them too high.

Conduit is the only thing that's mostly future proof. You did fine, it is possible to overdo it.

You should be able to pull cable to most of the house after it's built via the attic should the need arise.

 

[luisrodz]

House is complete. Any suggestion on camera placement?

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[luisrodz]

Hi all,

After doing some extensive reading I came with this final setup. I would like your final advice to see if the placement and equipment is correct. I bought an Elitedesk 800 G3 256 SSD with 4 TB Purple drive in which I'm going to be installing BI.

I'm planning to buying some IPC-HDW5231R-Z or maybe you have other suggestions so I can save some $$$. I'm planning to star with 6 cameras and then expand. Here're my the placement I chose. Any critique is accepted.



I forgot to add the floor plan.

 

[SouthernYankee]

Two cameras on the garage. Mount the cameras down to the upper edge on the garbage. Move the front door camera down. You need to see the people's face. Test it. Use a bucket, and 2x4 mount a camera mounted on it. Get a friend in a hoodie ball cap and sun glasses, see if you can easily identify them.

 

[luisrodz]

Two cameras on the garage. Mount the cameras down to the upper edge on the garbage. Move the front door camera down. You need to see the people's face. Test it. Use a bucket, and 2x4 mount a camera mounted on it. Get a friend in a hoodie ball cap and sun glasses, see if you can easily identify them.

Thank you for replying.

The problem I have in the front door is that the cable is coming out really high. I don’t know what should I do to lower it. The wall is masonry.

I have the same issue on the left back corner of the house.


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[SouthernYankee]

On some homes there is a space between the brick, outside wall and the foam board inside siding. I use a wire snake, and drill holes in the morter, run the snake into the attic. Pull the Ethernet cable down.

 

[luisrodz]

On some homes there is a space between the brick, outside wall and the foam board inside siding. I use a wire snake, and drill holes in the morter, run the snake into the attic. Pull the Ethernet cable down.

This is how it is placed before stucco.

I really don’t know if I’m going to be able to pull down the wires. I only have this problem in three spots.


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[tangent]

House is complete. Any suggestion on camera placement?

The problem I have in the front door is that the cable is coming out really high. I don’t know what should I do to lower it. The wall is masonry.

Can you post a picture showing what you have to work with for wire now that the house is finished?
If you had things prewired I'm a little confused why your asking for location advice now...

If you want to lower that camera you may have to use conduit and possibly even a coupler.

 

[mat200]

Two cameras on the garage. Mount the cameras down to the upper edge on the garbage. Move the front door camera down. You need to see the people's face. Test it. Use a bucket, and 2x4 mount a camera mounted on it. Get a friend in a hoodie ball cap and sun glasses, see if you can easily identify them.

"House is complete. Any suggestion on camera placement?"

@luisrodz

SourthernYankee and Tangent have excellent points which I concur with. Wished you had looked closer at this issue during the construction of the house, now that the construction is done it will be significantly more work to adjust the locations.

In general I think your cameras are mounted high - and the ones next to the flood light, you are going to want to test that location with the flood light both on and off. If the lights are in the view of the camera it will affect the quality of the image.

I would also consider 2 cameras or the dual lens camera that looney2ns reviewed for the front door area. I really believe in a camera at eye level by the front door.