Needing an outdoor PoE setup cameras

[bmninada]

I live in a relatively safe neighborhood single family corner home. Till date was using Panasonic Homehawk which is battery operated Wifi and I am simply fed up. Before posting here I did my research and found I already have a good backbone setup. (1) My entire home already uses Unifi and Unifi POE+ switches and access points POE based and I use Synology 4-bay disk station.
Thus - only option I am considering is PoE based outdoor cameras.

The way my house is structured I'll need a lot of cameras to cover all angles and I called someone who said if I go for 3 PTZ cameras which can auto roam I'll be able to cover my house fully. Alternatively if I go with fixed cameras I'll need minimum 7 to 8 as I have 4 exit doors, backyard, park on street and basement windows. That'll make it cost prohibitive.
Unfortunately, I have fallen in love with the fact that against my main door the camera I have can 2 way talk which has been a God Send to me. Thus, that's something I'll like to retain, as a feature.

My home is actually well light, from the perspective of street lights, doors having bright lights which come on if motion is detected, etc. and thus having really awesome low light capability is good but not must have.

With this background wondering if there are suggestions available for me to review? In a nutsheel:

1. PTZ capability - which can auto track in case of movement detection, human, vehicle is a must, Great to have: if facial recognition is feasible, license plate read is feasible.
2. PTZ should be able to move back and forth automatically thus scanning continuously a good area.
3. Defining zones/perimeters, tripping points, etc.
4. 2 way talk - now I understand 2-way talk especially for PTZ is hard to come by thus at least 1 2-way talk is 100% required.

 

[mat200]

I live in a relatively safe neighborhood single family corner home. Till date was using Panasonic Homehawk which is battery operated Wifi and I am simply fed up. Before posting here I did my research and found I already have a good backbone setup. (1) My entire home already uses Unifi and Unifi POE+ switches and access points POE based and I use Synology 4-bay disk station.
Thus - only option I am considering is PoE based outdoor cameras.

The way my house is structured I'll need a lot of cameras to cover all angles and I called someone who said if I go for 3 PTZ cameras which can auto roam I'll be able to cover my house fully. Alternatively if I go with fixed cameras I'll need minimum 7 to 8 as I have 4 exit doors, backyard, park on street and basement windows. That'll make it cost prohibitive.
Unfortunately, I have fallen in love with the fact that against my main door the camera I have can 2 way talk which has been a God Send to me. Thus, that's something I'll like to retain, as a feature.

My home is actually well light, from the perspective of street lights, doors having bright lights which come on if motion is detected, etc. and thus having really awesome low light capability is good but not must have.

With this background wondering if there are suggestions available for me to review? In a nutsheel:

1. PTZ capability - which can auto track in case of movement detection, human, vehicle is a must, Great to have: if facial recognition is feasible, license plate read is feasible.
2. PTZ should be able to move back and forth automatically thus scanning continuously a good area.
3. Defining zones/perimeters, tripping points, etc.
4. 2 way talk - now I understand 2-way talk especially for PTZ is hard to come by thus at least 1 2-way talk is 100% required.

Welcome @bmninada

Take some time to learn more before you jump into this.

Get 1 4mp 1/1.8" sensor varifocal camera to play around with first .. there is a lot more to this than just buying a kit and installing.

 

[bmninada]

Welcome @bmninada

Take some time to learn more before you jump into this.

Get 1 4mp 1/1.8" sensor varifocal camera to play around with first .. there is a lot more to this than just buying a kit and installing.

Actually that's the type of setup temporarily what my friend did. He works in a company and the company doesn't sell to home owners and their products are prohibitively expensive anyways. This friend of mine put 3 so called "bullet cameras" for 2 weeks and frankly I didn't like it. Realized will need quite a large set to cover everything. The model he used is: DH-IPC-HFW7442H-Z-X . Then he used this temporarily: 5A445GBNR and told me to get PTZ.

 

[mat200]

Actually that's the type of setup temporarily what my friend did. He works in a company and the company doesn't sell to home owners and their products are prohibitively expensive anyways. This friend of mine put 3 so called "bullet cameras" for 2 weeks and frankly I didn't like it. Realized will need quite a large set to cover everything. The model he used is: DH-IPC-HFW7442H-Z-X . Then he used this temporarily: 5A445GBNR and told me to get PTZ.

Did your friend get PTZ cameras already ?

 

[bmninada]

Please permit me to clarify - everything he gave me is from his truck, temporarily. He has already taken everything away. I am in NJ and there's a huge Amazon warehouse being constructed and he's designing the outside security. So he happens to have a bunch of these commercial grade cameras and he used a few hooking them up temporarily to let me see, observe and decide. For fun, he gave me temp access to some weird camera which detected even hot/cold spots in my backyard. It was fun to watch a deer at night showing up all red in blue background .... felt like real-life Hollywood film. Of course I don't need one ...
Just for reference - he showed me the box of the camera actually selected for Amazon warehouse. Model's AXIS Q6010-E and another one: Q6315-LE for their main outdoor areas....

 

[mat200]

Please permit me to clarify - everything he gave me is from his truck, temporarily. He has already taken everything away. I am in NJ and there's a huge Amazon warehouse being constructed and he's designing the outside security. So he happens to have a bunch of these commercial grade cameras and he used a few hooking them up temporarily to let me see, observe and decide. For fun, he gave me temp access to some weird camera which detected even hot/cold spots in my backyard. It was fun to watch a deer at night showing up all red in blue background .... felt like real-life Hollywood film.

So next question .. does he have 24/7 security personnel watching the PTZ cameras ?

PTZ cameras are nice, but for most homes it is better to have fixed fov cameras that are good vs PTZ cameras.

 

[bmninada]

So next question .. does he have 24/7 security personnel watching the PTZ cameras ?

PTZ cameras are nice, but for most homes it is better to have fixed fov cameras that are good vs PTZ cameras.

I apologize this topic never came up. Obviously as he does such heavy complex industrial he's used to 24 x 7 monitoring so he never thought of this. May I ask why for a home which doesn't have 24 x 7 PTZ aren't recommended?

 

[bmninada]

I just called and asked. He said about a company called Empire Tech something which has some PTZ which has advanced AI driven functions allowing the camera to self track and follow movements. The need for manually logging in and turning camera around (PTZ) is not required. BUT he did say - it needs to be confirmed if such cameras are able to detect motion across the angles they are configured to operate, i.e. if the camera is configured to operate from 0-deg. to 90-deg and -90 deg., then it ought to detect motion across this range OR have the ability to continuous move between these 2 end points repeatedly.

 

[wittaj]

PTZs are a compliment to an existing system.

Unless you are putting up the expensive industrial PTZs, you will wear these out quickly having them on patrol. Plus a 24/7 monitored system where they see something and take control of the PTZ and manually follow them around is much different than an autotracking PTZ in a home situation.

Empiretech cameras a great cameras (Dahua OEM) and sold by trusted vendor @EMPIRETECANDY here and on Amazon, but we would not put them on auto-cycle patrol.

You don't want to do pan/scan as the PTZs are only rated for so many "cycles" and folks that have used patrol have had the system become inoperable as a PTZ after a couple years. One person locked theirs up in a year.

Plus, while the PTZ is in motion in a pan/scan, it will not be able to identify and start tracking. It needs to sit stationary for a few to allow the tracking rules to be established and then start checking motion against it.

Plus, if it is cycling it can be avoided by a perp and miss the action.

So with only 3 PTZs and no additional fixed cameras - what happens when 2 or more people come up to your house - the PTZ is only catching and tracking one of them, not all of them.

PTZs are not perfect and can lose tracking. Then you miss the person.

What happens when the PTZ is looking left and a perp comes from the right?

That is why PTZs are not a replacement for fixed cameras - they are a compliment to an existing system.

If you rely on a PTZ only it will miss many instances, especially when it is off tracking something else.

You are much better off using fixed cams as spotter cams to point the PTZ to where the action is and then let the autotracking take over from there.

See this thread on how a PTZ compliments a fixed camera system.

Using Spotter Cameras to direct a PTZ where to look in an NVR or Blue Iris and setting a spotter cam as a priority in Blue Iris

We get this question from time to time, so I thought with the recent addition to BI, it made sense to have a thread we can point to. Previously in BI, if you had more than one spotter cam, you could not make one a priority, so if spotter cam #1 triggered the PTZ and it starts tracking and...

ipcamtalk.com

Regarding plates, you would have to set the camera up specifically to read plates. You need the proper camera with OPTICAL zoom for the distance you are covering and the angle to get plates. A PTZ is not a good choice for this.

Keep in mind that this is a camera dedicated to plates and not an overview camera also. It is as much an art as it is a science. You will need two cameras. For LPR we need to OPTICALLY zoom in tight to make the plate as large as possible. For most of us, all you see is the not much more than a vehicle in the entire frame. Now maybe in the right location during the day it might be able to see some other things, but not at night.

At night, we have to run a very fast shutter speed (1/2,000) and in B/W with IR and the image will be black. All you will see are head/tail lights and the plate. Some people can get away with color if they have enough street lights, but most of us cannot. Here is a representative sample of plates I get at night of vehicles traveling about 45MPH at 175 feet from my 2MP 5241-Z12E camera (that is all that is needed for plates):

See the LPR subforum for more details.

 

[Mastachekity]

mm mm honestly what you want is overkill. frankly, I agree with Mike not about getting more research but the fact that having PTZ is overkill and unreliable in most cases. you're better off using 4mp cameras in each corner to cover or a 180 to cover the space you going to need. for the LP cameras, you need a dedicated/specifically to read LP, often times you also need an NVR that can work in recording the events, in this case, the data of the license plate. For the cameras use ones with a microphone built into it, I typically install open-eye cameras turret but those are commercial find something similar. Also, the NVR uses one that works with the Specific LPC you want to use. PTZ in residential is a no-no.

 

[bmninada]

Thank you all. Scratching requirement - for license plate reader. Scratching requirement for PTZ.

Then it boils down to:

1. 2 MP / 4 MP cameras and trying to figure out if I need optical zoom or not. What's the benefit for having optical zoom?
2. I will definitely need very good then low-light capabilities and for which I read will need 100% 2 things: Something called StarLight and sensor better be 1.8 or less.
3. 1 thing I 100% need - defining either zone or perimeters. In other words, if motion happens within that perimeter/zone camera should be capable to detect and alert me.
4. I have a lot of bushes and trees surrounding my property. This is where my previous 2 setups failed - they detected trees/bushes swaying and constantly kept notifying me. Need something capable to understand these need not be tracked / reported.
5. Based off the recommendations made here - I am now 99% certain will go with cameras spread at my home corners or other strategic locations. 1 thing I always loved was my current camera (which is shitty) capable for 2 way talk. That's 1 thing I 100% need at least in 1 camera. Are there any good POE driven doorbell cameras?

 

[Mastachekity]

There is however there relatively new technology with nvrs so they do have some work to do on them. I saw a YouTube breakdown of the top Poe doorbell cameras and the best was reolink however I’m not sure if reolink sales LPC that can record or store the plates. I don’t even think they sale lpc anyways here is the yt video I saw also some feature may not be abatible if you don’t have the same NVR or maybe they have you tied in to their app only I hope this helps

 

[wittaj]

Digital zoom only works in the movies. You need optical zoom to IDENTIFY at further distances.

See this thread for the commonly recommended cameras (along with Amazon links) based on distance to IDENTIFY that represent the overall best value in terms of price and performance day and night.

The Importance of Focal Length over MP in camera selection

The cameras in that list include AI, which most of us find is really good at eliminating false triggers. Mine only trigger for the objects I want.

Because of this, mine only alert me when it meets the criteria I set.

Who uses Dahua AI capable cameras? Reliable AI for triggering events? Pro's/con's?

It has come to my attention that certain Dahua cameras come with built in AI that distinguishes between human & cars. I was unaware of this. Well, always saw the AI word used in the reviews but never really thought about it because I thought it was a Dahua NVR integration only. I am currently...

ipcamtalk.com

The two-way talk cameras are kinda gimmicky and operate more like walkie-talkie. Good for yelling "get off my lawn" but not real good for a conversation. Doorbell cams do a much better job as two can talk at same time.

This is the only product from Reolink most recommend:

New Reolink Wired POE Doorbell Cam ?

Recently found a few release articles and videos by Reolink on their new POE Doorbell Camera. Per comments by Reolink it's ONVIF and RTSP compliant. Although I've been running a YooSee SD-M5 POE doorbell somewhat successfully for several years now I check back here from time to time to see if...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[garycrist]

Think of security in layers. That PTZ might be great out far but, did it catch
that porch pirate's face or back of his head? Speaking of heads, mount them up high
as car roofs are in short supply. I say these things in jest but, don't houses have at
least 4 sides?

I'll add, I worked the docks at Yellow for a "few" years. Those cameras were to catch
internal thieves, both time and product! After the fact in most cases too. The Dock across from
us, has zoom-in cams that saw across the dock into a trailer X 42 stalls! Who is going to monitor
42 trailers at a time? Only in Vegas!!