Advantages of a NVR Vs. Blue Iris and a PC?

Discussion in 'Chit-Chat' started by Chust, Dec 27, 2015.

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  1. Chust

    Chust Getting the hang of it

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    For awhile now. I been thinking about getting a NVR. But, I just don't see any advantage! It seems to me Blue Iris is way better. Is it because you don't need a router?
     
  2. wpsfan

    wpsfan n3wb

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    I was 100% set on BI and a PC, though thanks to a forum member I scored a great deal for a complete system with NVR on newegg. The only real advantage of a NVR that I know of is cost, a capable PC to run BI is around $300+ if you don't have one, I believe the software is like $50? Could be wrong. That is what my entire setup + 2 TB HDD cost. I'd definitely go for BI if you don't care about cost as much, and I may do so later, though I just couldn't justify spending 2-3x as much after buying everything to get BI running.
     
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  3. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    There is no real advantage other than cost. Blue iris is superior in every way...you could not pay me to use an NVR..
     
  4. klasipca

    klasipca Banned

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    It depends what you are trying to accomplish. BI + PC is certainly superior in terms of software, but NVR is simpler, efficient, cheaper and easier to maintain then a full blown pc.
     
  5. Chust

    Chust Getting the hang of it

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    For the price I have decided to go with a NVR for my next build. I will of course keep Blue Iris. Now if and when Blue Iris offers hardware acceleration, and if when AMD comes out with an efficient 16 core CPU, hopefully in 2016. Then until then, yeah a NVR is the way to go for the money.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 28, 2015
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  6. wpsfan

    wpsfan n3wb

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    @Chust ..not sure if you just need a nvr but check out the thread in this sub-forum about the newegg special that @fenderman posted. The nvr alone is supposedly $300 and the cameras are around $125 a piece. All that for $299. I ordered 1, probably ordering another.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 5, 2016
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  7. Chust

    Chust Getting the hang of it

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    hmmm, seems to be good deal. Thank you!
     
  8. vector18

    vector18 Getting comfortable

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    I've never used BI, but I've used PC nvr's and have found that PC's give more of a headache than an actual NVR. I have seen DVR's and NVR's running trouble free for years and years, and I am constantly returning to customers that have PC's as recorders to troubleshoot issues. Manufacturers have spent a ton of money to design something to run 24/7 and IMO, a PC is not designed to run 24/7. For those that are in favor of a PC and it's (superior) software, can you give some examples of something that it could do that an NVR cannot?
     
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  9. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    @vector18, were the pc's you were troubleshooting modern systems with decent vms? or were the old systems using analog cameras with encoder cards built into the pc?
    Here are just a few things - there are many many more. This is for blue iris.
    1) use a combination of almost any cameras
    2) Set distinct motion sensitivity recording vs alerts, this is important to minimize false alerts but still capture all movement.
    3) Set distinct motion settings for night vs day based on sunrise sunset (so it adjust automatically through the year)
    4) easily disable/enable motion detection or alerts when you get home or leave-you can pick and choose which cameras will still be active..for example, you can have the indoor cameras to be disabled but the outdoor cams to record and alert.
    5) The mobile app is MUCH easier to use and review video than NVR's
    6) The server app is much easier to use than an NVR interface.
    7) simultaneously record to local storage and nas.
    8) you can setup storage so that some cameras (primary) store footage for longer periods than others.
    9) You can take a single camera feed and split it onto several virtual cameras (this helps if you want to give a user access to only a specific portion of the camera feed).
    10) if your camera supports audio out (talk) you can send any prerecorded alert to play though the camera upon motion.
    11) If you camera supports audio in your can trigger recording on audio detection.
    12) if you have a matrix setup for live view where one camera is larger than others so you can see it better, you can set blue iris to display the camera that is detecting motion on the larger view.
    13) easily upload video to ftp.
    I have over 20 blue iris machines running as smooth as butter..the key is using a quality machine dedicated to the vms.
    Also with a pc, if there is a hardware issue you can quickly replace it with a pc from any local store and just import the config file..whereas if your NVR dies a to order it wait for delivery and reprogram it (if its not the same model).
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 5, 2016
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  10. vector18

    vector18 Getting comfortable

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    1) Even on an NVR you can use different brand cameras, maybe not as many, but you can.
    2) An NVR can adjust sensitivity and even set different sensitivity levels in different areas of the image
    3) An NVR can set a different schedule for different types of recordings
    4) In an NVR you can disable/enable motion detection alerts and chose which cameras
    5) I never saw the BI app, but I really like IDMSS
    6) Once I program my NVR, I don't need my phone to change settings
    7) Certain NVR's, not low end ones can record to an external HDD and internal at the same time
    8) Some NVR's have Quota option
    9) not sure what you mean
    10) I might be able to do this with an alarm option, I think the cube camera even does this and lets you upload an audio file of your own?
    11) I do not think an NVR can do this
    12) Better NVR's can do this, spot monitoring
    13) I do not use FTP, but I believe an NVR can

    I have over 200 NVR's that I have personally installed in the past 2 years alone. I think I had to return two of them due to a problem and that was a week after install so more than likely it was defective. I'm not saying a quality PC cannot do the job and a tech savy person can use BI to it's full potential, but I am personally more interested in more user friendly, simple plug and play for the end user, and less maintenance. If I gave PC's to every one of my installs, I just feel that it would be a nightmare for myself.
     
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  11. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    1) yes but you are very limited, particularly if you want to use advanced motion detection available in the camera.
    2) I mean different sensitivity for motion recording vs motion alerts. You cannot do that with an nvr. This allows you to set the threshold higher for alerts (to avoid false alerts, but lower for recording so you never miss anything)
    3) To clarify, with an NVR you need to manually set day/night, this time changes though the year. With blue iris it will automatically adjust relative to sunrise sunset in your specific location - this lets you dial in perfect motion settings for day/night. You can also set different thresholds for when you are away vs home etc..
    4)Yes, but not on the fly from the app with one press of a button like you can with blue iris. What do people do when they get home? You cant expect someone to manually make the changes each time. This is my biggest issue with NVR;s.
    5) I never used idmss, but its light years ahead of hikvisions ivms4500.
    6) I mean the server application - the software running on the pc, for video review and setup.
    7) can they record to nas? even if so, you need to buy the more expensive units
    8) I havent seen an NVR with a per camera quota but if so, its likely the more expensive units.
    9) You can take a single camera feed and virtually split it into two cameras.
    10) If you mean the hik cube, i dont believe this is possible.
    11) agreed
    12) I haven't seen this option is the 200-400 range nvr's
    13) At least with hikvision, video cannot be uploaded ftp.

    There are many more features and functions that usera like about blue iris, would take all day to discuss them. But even for above functions alone I would not switch back even if the NVR was free to me. I'm not saying NVR's are bad - for most folks who just want basic recording and forget about the device, its the best solution. But personally I could never user one after seeing what pc based software can do. The developer constantly adds function to the software as well.
     
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  12. vector18

    vector18 Getting comfortable

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    All good points and I don't think we disagree with each other. Hopefully this would help someone decide between the two. As I have mentioned and I'm sure you agree, you need a well suited PC to run
    the software and record the cameras. You need to be semi tech savy have the needs for more options available than a standard NVR. If someone is looking for basic recording, remote viewing, and several options that an NVR offers, than an NVR is the way to go. If someone is looking to fully customize their options and wants to able to do more things, than a PC is the way to go.
     
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  13. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    Agreed.
     
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  14. Acolar

    Acolar n3wb

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    That was a very educational thread on NVR Vs. BI
    This newbie thanks both of you!
     
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  15. klasipca

    klasipca Banned

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    Can someone share actual numbers with wattage usage running a few cams with poe switch + PC? In my case 5 cams connected to NVR (3 are power hungry Huisun) I am using up ~40 watts during day and ~60 watts during night, Also have 3 wireless cams which record to it, so that's probably another +10 watts.
     
  16. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    Here is a power sample for PC only. The power consumption of the poe switch/cameras will be static so the only variable is the pc.
    https://www.ipcamtalk.com/showthread.php/5696-PC-NVR-Power-Consumption-Sample?highlight=consumption
     
  17. klasipca

    klasipca Banned

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  18. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    just add the power consumption of the cameras/poe switch to the BI consumption...disconnect your nvr and measure or put the meter on the poe switch power supply.....
    The number will vary by load on the processor as well.
    On an average 6 camera 1080p system with the BI machine consuming 40w-70w (depending on machines) and the cameras consuming 3-5w (dahua/hikvision) you are looking at 60-90w in power consumption...these numbers are very general as it depends on the pc's efficiency, processor, and total camera resolution load.
     
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  19. Mobius2011

    Mobius2011 n3wb

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    Great discussion, thanks for the review of feature sets of both NVR & BI. Ive only ever used BI and would like to learn how to configure some of those things mentioned by Fenderman. My usage seems pretty basic. I'd like to give an NVR a go some time. Vector 18, what is a couple of NVR's you would recommend?
     
  20. pinko

    pinko Getting the hang of it

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    This is why ipcamtalk needs a wiki. I keep finding gems like this. Thankyou :)
     
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  21. drunkpenguin

    drunkpenguin Getting comfortable

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    I was forced into BI by q-see. My nvr died after a failed software update and they told me to basically go #### myself. Since I had q-see cameras I figured my best option was another q-see nvr, but I didnt want to give them any more money, or a computer based system. Google led me very quickly to BI and the rest is history. For me the biggest selling point is it works with any cam. So as I upgrade or add more cameras I won't have to give q-see yet even more money.

    After using BI for the last couple of months I'm with Fenderman, I could never ever go back to one of those crappy chinese nvrs with software written by the worst English translator in world history!
     
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  22. CheesyPoofs

    CheesyPoofs n3wb

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    Hello-new to the forum. Want to ask how BI works. I am looking to replace my whole wired system, that runs to a NVR that has a horrible interface that my wife and I hate.
    Anyway, I want to go to HD cameras using POE. I'm not sure if I will use a POE switch to connect the cameras to the PC running BI, or how that works. I am just not getting the connectivity part. Can someone help me figure this out?
     
  23. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    If you currently have an NVR then you are using ip cameras...all you would need is a poe switch...the switch can then be connected to the pc or any multitude of network setups...
     
  24. CheesyPoofs

    CheesyPoofs n3wb

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    I may have misidentified what I have. It is an analog setup with cameras attached via BNC. I'll replace the whole system, and go with 4MP (or greater) cameras.
     
  25. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    Dont chase megapixels....see the threads on the 2mp starlight dahua cameras...much much better nightvison and low light vision than 4mp cams...
     
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  26. raidflex

    raidflex n3wb

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    Anyone have experience with running a small amount of 2MP cameras (2-4) at most in a VM on windows 10. I have a Freenas system which is a media server among other things and is idle most of the time and since I already have this PC running 24/7 I would prefer to utilize this for Blue Iris. Since this would be a Win10 VM hardware acceleration for Blue Iris I am guessing would not function, and even if it did the Xeon 1230V3 CPU does not support quicksync.

    I am planning at most 4 Dahua 2MP cameras, more then likely it may only end up being 2-3 and I do not need 24/7 recording, also I would set it up for motion detection recording only. Electric costs are basically the highest in the US where I live so I really would like to avoid running another PC for such a small amount of cameras.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2017
  27. mark_whocares

    mark_whocares n3wb

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    the biggest reason i'm not using BI, is it requires a windows instance. would love to see BI for *nix. (if this option exists someone plz point me at it)
     
  28. fenderman

    fenderman Staff Member

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    would not make a single difference...windows vs linux would not matter at all, zero.....there are other vms that runs on linux if you are that foolishly stubborn...
     
  29. looney2ns

    looney2ns Known around here

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  30. sn1050

    sn1050 n3wb

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    I'm new to security cameras and might have some stupid questions I would greatly appreciate anyone's answers on. To preface my questions I purchased BI, 5MP PoE varifocal lens camera, & a PoE switch to link to my existing router. The main purpose of this camera is to mount on the front exterior of my house to record any would be thieves & vehicles license plates associated with those thieves. We've been having a lot of car break ins in my neighborhood lately. After doing more research I'm thinking I might have jumped the gun on my purchase/set up. I was planing on subscribing to some cloud service to save my recordings & didn't even see anything prior about a NAS system. Here are a few questions I have after reading some articles on y'alls forum:

    1. I've installed BI onto my work lap top. Does this computer have to always be on for BI to record? When I'm home this won't be a problem, but when I'm out and about for work the computer will be in my truck with me either turned off or asleep 90% of the time. My personal computer is a Mac so I do not have the option of using it. If the computer does have to always be on I may have wasted my money on BI. If so, any recommendations for a NVR system that will pair up with this camera?
    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0776Z8W8F/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1

    2. Does BI give any option for continuous recording? Obviously the answer to that question doesn't matter too much if my computer always has to be on.
    3. Would a NAS system be a better option than a cloud based storage system? If so, any cost efficient recommendations?

    Thanks in advance for your help!

    -Stuart