How to properly wire/mount cameras... new construction

Discussion in 'Accessories' started by 105437, Jul 4, 2018.

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  1. 105437

    105437 Getting the hang of it

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    Building a new home and I will be running IP camera wiring very soon now that framing is done. What is the proper way to terminate the wire outside under the soffit. Should I install a low voltage box and then use a cover plate with RJ45 keystone or should I just run the wire straight to the camera? I'll also be using a passive PoE Injector/splitter for these to provide IR illuminators as well. Thanks!
     
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  2. looney2ns

    looney2ns IPCT Contributor

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    How high off the ground are the soffits? If higher than 8ft, thats too high.
    Run two or three Ethernet cables to each location. One for cam, one for Ir lighting, one as a spare.
    Cable's cheap, nows the time to do it right.
    Terminate in a 4" metal box, that is secured to wood.

    Best practice.....have a cam or two on hand right now and test the locations you are thinking of before pulling wire. Test a min of 24hrs.
    8ft 2x4, 5gal bucket, and rocks or sand makes a good temp test mount.
     
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  3. tangent

    tangent IPCT Contributor

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    • You can get a camera in the soffits later if you have to. Getting one lower down the wall is much harder after the fact.
    • Take LOTS of pictures before the drywall goes up.
    • Install a junction box for the cameras, leave yourself some extra wire, and don't terminate until you're ready to install the cameras. Put a blank cover over the box for now.
      • This gets a little tricky as cams generally don't mount nicely to standard US junction boxes.
      • The PFB203W | Dahua Technology does mount to a horizontal single gang box and can work well in some locations.
      • Generally your options are a camera that's trying to straddle a box, a camera mounted to a blank outdoor cover, or mounting a box designed for the camera you're using on top of the box in the wall. Siding mounting blocks are also an option
    • Test camera locations, small adjustments can make a big difference. As a minimum, walk around with your phone and a selfie stick and take some pictures in various locations.
    How many stories is the house?
    What kind of siding/exterior finish?
     
  4. 105437

    105437 Getting the hang of it

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    Great advice so far, keep it coming and thanks!

    The soffit will definitely be higher than 8' on one side. So I'll plan on lowering them. Tell me more about how to power IR with an Ethernet cable.
     
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  5. tangent

    tangent IPCT Contributor

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    If you post some pics of the house or blueprints and where you're thinking of putting cameras you'll get more specific advice.

    The higher you mount a camera the farther away it needs to look if you don't wan't to just see the tops of heads. Mounting a camera higher can make sense in some situations, but a lens with more zoom and looking farther away is necessary for best results.

    Be sure to search for things like "new construction" Search Results for Query: "new construction" | IP Cam Talk
     
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  6. tangent

    tangent IPCT Contributor

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    The wall material has a big impact on your initial question. Brick, stucco, and siding warrant different approaches.
     
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  7. 105437

    105437 Getting the hang of it

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    I'll post a floor plan later tonight. The siding will be hardi lap where the cameras will be. Thanks!
     
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  8. mat200

    mat200 IPCT Contributor

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    Welcome and Happy 4th of July @105437

    Looney2ns and Tangent have already give some great advice, I didn't see the following stressed...

    so

    OVER CABLE!!!

    seriously... now is the time when the framing is up.

    N+1+ per each location.

    Think of more than just camera locations, also media center, speakers, alarm, alexa/audio stuff, temp sensors....
    ( iirc we have a nice list in the cliff notes IPCamTalk WiKi | IP Cam Talk )

    Also, for electrical - USE metal boxes. Seriously, the plastic boxes are just too weak - seen them busted too many times.
     
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  9. 105437

    105437 Getting the hang of it

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    Thanks @mat200. You're right, now's the time to run everything and then some. I've been thinking of all of those items and have started a wiring plan with locations for everything. I'll be doing my own wiring to a central IT/media closet.

    Here is my floor plan, it's all one level except a bonus room above the garage and just over 2,000 sq. ft.
     

    Attached Files:

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  10. mat200

    mat200 IPCT Contributor

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    Looks like this will be a fun project.

    Recently seen some great reviews on sound proofing and termite / roach prevention ideas on youtube.

    This channel has been a fun to watch one:
    Matt Risinger
    ( look for his prep work )

    Prewiring


    Some interesting radiant barrier stuff on there also..
    radiant barrier attic insulation - YouTube
     
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  11. 105437

    105437 Getting the hang of it

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    @mat200... I've been watching Risinger's channel for a few months and I know exactly the episode you're talking about when it comes to using Bora-Care! I had also watched the 8 Things video as well. I'm learning so much and can't wait to start running everything. Just placed a huge order with Monoprice for all the structured wiring supplies.
     
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  12. tangent

    tangent IPCT Contributor

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    I'd prewire for outdoor motion sensors in a few key locations.

    Wiring to media or office locations is pretty important.

    It is possible to over do it on the wiring, but running more wires than you think you need is good advice. The builder will probably want you to do low voltage cabling after the electrical, plumbing, and HVAC. If you get to do your wiring first, you need to be careful not to consume a space one of the other trades needs. It's also likely your wiring could be damaged.
    • Keep your wires 12"+ away from the electrical, more is better cross electrical at right angles and maintain 1-2" separation.
    • Don't cut or drill any holes so big you compromise the structure and make sure you use a fire stop caulk or foam to fill your holes. This sounds obvious, but for some people it isn't sadly.
    • In the grand scheme of things, you may not have time to do all the wiring you want. A good plan and having the materials and tools ready is important. Having multiple spools of cable on hand makes pulling multiple wires at the same time easier, but pulling 2-4 cables to a location is a lot easier than 8. When it comes to actually pulling the cable manage your priorities and time carefully.
    • Plan your runs like a tree with right angle branches and make a plan for keeping the 'trunk' of the tree organized (various cabling hanging /organizing implements). In some cases you might have several trunks.
    • Choose the location(s) for your rack / structured wiring cabinet(s) carefully. It needs to be functional and to appeal to your wife as well as a future buyer of the house.
    There are a lot of other threads on the subject that I'd rather you seek out than repeating myself in too much more detail. Some of these feature what not to do.
    New to home security surveillance and need some advice
    Analysis paralysis: low voltage cables through drywall
    Camera Install Height on New Construction?
    New House, outdoor rough wiring for security cameras
    New DYI guy with new project
    Advice wanted - planning 1st install
    New Dahua install
     
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  13. tangent

    tangent IPCT Contributor

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    It's harder to do after the fact, but most of your house should be accessible from the attic if you need to run more cables somewhere in the future. The rooms with cathedral ceilings could be among the most difficult places to get wires after the fact.
     
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  14. looney2ns

    looney2ns IPCT Contributor

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    Use the 2nd Ethernet cable to run power from the head end to ir light. Study the cliff notes in the wiki, if you haven't yet. Y o u don't want be messing with splitters at the cam ends.
     
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  15. 105437

    105437 Getting the hang of it

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    @tangent... Awesome advice and I really appreciate you taking the time to include those links! Super helpful. HVAC and plumbing rough in is done. The electrician starts Monday so I'll be ready to go once he's finished with his rough in.

    A few things...
    1) I love your idea of pre-wiring for motion sensors. I'd love to use a PIR sensor for triggering motion alerts & recordings in Blue Iris. Is that possible? I need to read up on what type of wiring I need to run for that.
    2) My IT closet has a door on the front and rear so access should be just fine.
    3) Are attic runs preferred to crawlspace? I will have full attic access once construction is finished. Crawlspace is a little tight and has a lot of plumbing and HVAC ducts in the way. Any reasons for concern when it comes to years of heat and the cables?
    4) I would much rather use an IR illuminator powered by it's own Cat6 cable instead of a splitter. I need to read up on which IR illuminators can be powered like that.
    5) Any comments on where I should mount cameras based on the floor plan I posted above would be greatly appreciated!

    All of you folks who are helping me with this project are fantastic. What a great community we have here helping newbies like me out. I hope to contribute in the future to help someone as I learn more!
     
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  16. looney2ns

    looney2ns IPCT Contributor

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    1-Ethernet cable can be used, use one pair for power and one pair for the trigger relay. Yes, for triggering BI.
    3-Whatever is easiest, just remember to do it in such a way that you can find it after the insulation goes in. Do it neatly, and label both ends of every cable.
    4-Any of them can be, just use the 1 Ethernet cable to send power from IT closet to the IR.
    5-I'll look at the plans and get back to that, if someone else doesn't beat me to it.
     
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  17. 105437

    105437 Getting the hang of it

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    For #1, are there wiring drawings that show how to wire the pairs to a PIR sensor?
    For #4, do all IR illuminators come with an RJ45 connection for this?

    Thanks!
     
  18. tangent

    tangent IPCT Contributor

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    1. Depends on what you're hooking it to and how long the cable is. Ethernet cable can work but, the twists add capacitance which can reduce noise or cause problems depending on what it hooked to. You can also treat each pair as a single wire, negating the twists. You're runs will likely be short enough this won't matter. You have lots of choices for what you hook these too, one option is a normal alarm system setting them so they don't trigger the alarm. Then you can interface the alarm with other home automation and blue iris.

    3. Do whatever is easiest. From, below it's harder to identify where walls are. So, installing after the fact from the crawlspace is harder. If you primarily use the crawlspace in your initial install, your runs will probably be a little shorter. The crawlspace may be faster with less time on a ladder, but it would depend on how confined the crawlspace is. For attic runs that aren't suspended up above the insulation and are perpendicular to the trusses consider placing some pieces of 1x4" on either side to protect the cables from being stepped on. This is required within 7' of the attic entrance, but I'd do it everywhere. I couldn't tell from what you posted earlier that you had a crawlspace so I just assumed you were planning an attic install.

    Here are some examples of things that could be used to support cables:
    Erico Caddy CAT J-hook Cable Support System - Cableorganizer.com
    Loop Cable Tie Hanger - Arlington Industries - Cableorganizer.com
    Bridle Rings for Low-Voltage Cable Support - Cableorganizer.com
    Plumbing supports like this: Oatey 4 in. DWV J-Hook Pipe Hanger-33511 - The Home Depot
    other plumbing and electrical supports work too.

    Are you planning to hardwire for an alarm system? Installing it yourself or having the builder install? Hardwired alarms are nice because the door and window sensors are hidden. Minimum I'd wire all exterior doors and some interior motion sensors.

    Sounds like you already bought a bunch of cable, but I highly recommend buying spools of wire that are different colors. It's very helpful when you're dealing with a bundle of cables.
     
  19. 105437

    105437 Getting the hang of it

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    Thanks again @tangent! The builder is installing the wired security. I'm only doing the network and AV cabling. I'm going to run everything I can in the attic and ideally hold the cables up along walls higher than the insulation will be. Good idea on the different colored jacket for Cat6. I'll buy another 500' spool since I'll probably need it.
     
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  20. looney2ns

    looney2ns IPCT Contributor

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    1-It's simple, the PIR will come with a diagram.
    4-No, not all, as you don't need them. You can always purchase a compatible male plugs to attach to the ethernet cable, then plug into the IR.

    Such as: https://www.amazon.com/SIM-NAT-Pigt...30810162&sr=8-21&keywords=male+connector+wire
     
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