Long distance camera install guidance

[seez52]

I have a rather long driveway and would like to view vehicles as they approach. Driveway is about 2400 ft. Currently I have a wireless sensor set at the end of the drive and am notified as a vehicle passes, but don't have any way to view.

There's a pole about 1000' from the house and this is where I'd like to mount a camera. At this point there is not power or wifi at the pole. I do have multiple pairs of 22 ga. wire running there but that's it. I have direct line of sight from the house to about 600', then it goes down hill and through some thick woods. I'm not concerned about recording the camera but rather would like to be able to pull up a live shot on my phone when I'm alerted by the sensor.

Is this doable? I was thinking about using a wireless bridge to the 600' location then wire the camera from there. The 22 ga. I don't think will carry enough current, but was wondering if it's possible to tie two of the 22ga wires together to provide power? Looked into a solar setup but that seems like a lot of extra hoops to jump through.

I've been researching this on various websites, but just can't determine if I can make it work. Suggestions would be appreciated?

 

[nayr]

yeah even AC current is not going to work down those wires.. You'd need like 10-12 AWG just for 24vac PTZ.. go run the numbers through a voltage drop calculator.

rent a trencher and burry some high voltage and low voltage lines in conduit out to your pole

 

[seez52]

I was afraid of that. I actually have conduit buried for all but one 270' feet so it shouldn't be too much trouble. I guess I need to know if what I want to do is possible, and if so what kind of hardware would work best. Then I can put in whatever wire is necessary.

 

[nayr]

an pole that far away you'll likely want to run fiberoptic cable so you can avoid repeaters and provide some electrical isolation..

some of these: https://www.amazon.com/MC200CM-Converter-1000Mbps-multi-mode-mountable/dp/B003AVRLZI/
and one of these: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00TH2TF9Y/

then you'll want to hire someone to come out and terminate the cables for you, it'll be cheaper than buying the equipment for a one time job.. might as well just hire someone to lay the fiber so you dont damage it.. a run that long is tricky.

I'd consider putting an outdoor WiFI access point on this pole since your doing so much work getting data and power out here.. for mobile devices roaming on your property.

 

[Ianc2]

Rg6 should get you there
rg11 will get you there
'fiber with media converters will get you there

or or you could just spend 30 bucks on a pair of baluns and use cat cable

 

[seez52]

an pole that far away you'll likely want to run fiberoptic cable so you can avoid repeaters and provide some electrical isolation..

some of these: https://www.amazon.com/MC200CM-Converter-1000Mbps-multi-mode-mountable/dp/B003AVRLZI/
and one of these: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00TH2TF9Y/

then you'll want to hire someone to come out and terminate the cables for you, it'll be cheaper than buying the equipment for a one time job.. might as well just hire someone to lay the fiber so you dont damage it.. a run that long is tricky.

I'd consider putting an outdoor WiFI access point on this pole since your doing so much work getting data and power out here.. for mobile devices roaming on your property.

I was looking at those earlier today! Fiber is probably the way to go. I'm on a hill and have had trouble with lightening. I used to have a wired driveway sensor it it was zapped twice by lightening. I"m thinking the fiber should minimize that.

I found some pre terminated fiber already set up with a pulling harness. Considering the expense of getting someone to terminate them that might be these least expansive route unless I can find a buddy with the equipment. Is there such a thing as fiber cable with some kind of runner so it could be hung between two poles? My section between two poles is really the only area where I don't have conduit buried. The ground in that area is pretty rocky so burial might be tough.

 

[CaliGirl]

A color IP camera setup certainly looks easier and cheaper for your particular setup. How much you think it cost to trench, conduit and run all those cables 2,400ft. with lighting protection?

I see lots of projects similar to your's on the web:

http://www.truelook.com/construction-cameras/solar-powered-webcams/











http://www.solarcam.fr/index_uk.html

 

[nayr]

solar is definitely doable, but it wont end up being much cheaper.. he's only going 1k feet, not 2400.

then you have the problems with keeping the panels snow free in the winter, and replacing some very expensive batteries every 5 years or so if your nice to them.

conduit is cheap as shit, and renting a trencher is not too bad.. the wiring/fiber will cost but the'll last the long term and he wont have power or bandwidth ceilings to worry about so if he wants a big honking street lamp out there, motorized gateway, wireless security sensors, etc he'll have that nearby.

with a driveway that long, I presume he is not getting a police response quickly.. early warning on driveway activity is great.. I have a friend whom got alerted a car was approaching his mountain cabin at 3am in the middle of winter.. he grabbed his shotgun and hid in the trees, watched an old beatup car roll up the driveway w/the lights out, 3 guys jumped out with guns so he opened fire and busted out the windows, headlights, and a tire before they all piled back in and reversed out of there in a hurry.. He called the sheriff and they caught em coming down the mountain with there maimed vehicle, all three were ex-cons and had firearms, found everything they needed to put em back in prison for 20 more years.. the alert that someone was coming up his 1/2 mile long driveway saved his ass; would have ended up much worse w/out it..

id spend the extra money and make it extremely reliable, dont want any false alerts or missed alerts on something like this..

 

[seez52]

OK, I think the fiber is the way to go. I can probably run the last section of conduit right next to a fence line and not actually have to bury it if the rock situation is a problem.

With regard to the camera: Don't really need a ptz. The area I want to monitor will be about 1100 ft. and closer to the camera and is a straight shot. From the time my existing sensor goes off, I should have about 30 seconds to take a look and see what's coming. I intentionally don't keep the pot holes repaired so as to keep vehicle speed down. If this camera is running all the time on my network, would checking it via my phone be a reasonable option? It would also be nice if the stream could be accessible on my TV so I could just flip over to the channel and check out what's going on.

 

[nayr]

a good ptz will give you variable zoom at a nice high speed.. go check out the video from CaliGirl's 4MP Black face dahua on a lake..

the camera has 2 alarm inputs, meaning you could hookup 2 sensors directly to the camera along the path and set them up as presets.. when someone runs over the sensor the camera will move to preset, this will give you a nice tracking ability.. and could even be used with an external automation system to determine direction (heading to house or leaving) and average speed.. leave it parked looking at a nice wide angle shot until someone actually triggers the sensors.. your going to need zoom or you wont see much until it gets close.

lots of choices to get it displayed on the TV, video recorder, android apps, etc.

 

[WT32]

I do have multiple pairs of 22 ga. wire running there but that's it. I don't think will carry enough current, but was wondering if it's possible to tie two of the 22ga wires together to provide power?

Just a heads up on running 2 pairs of 22ga wires over 600ft. If you used a poe injector at 48vdc the voltage drop is just under 10 volts so you could easily do this if you needed to. Running cables designed for it is obviously the ideal way to go but thought you may be interested.

 

[seez52]

that 30x ptz is nice, pricey but nice. Probably could get by with a 10x or 20x and it mentions that the lower zoom is better for night viewing which is important.

 

[CaliGirl]

nayr knows what he is talking about. I would definitely get some sort of PTZ so that it can be tripped by the driveway wire and zoom in on the car as it approaches. That way you can recognize what threat is coming your way. Then the second trip wire will spin the camera around and record the back end of the vehicle as it approaches the house. 2MP Dahua will give you better night vision then the 4mp. As will the lower zoom. Night vision is pretty amazing even with the 4mp 30x dahua. Of course, this could also be done with two cameras, but it is nice to have the controllability, zoom, and flexibility of one camera. That way you can sit back too and program it to your liking for the house vs. trying to get it all right standing on a ladder by a pole. Also, you need to switch between two cameras on the feed vs. one constant feed.

You can easily get a cheep LCD TV to put on the wall that is dedicated to the camera. And of these feeds can be observed from a smart phone.

Do you have a gate that opens and closes to your driveway? That may be a more simple approach to increased security and they have nice solar powered versions.

 

[seez52]

No gate, and according to my UPS man I shouldn't consider one. Apparently a number of his deliveries are to people with gates and they are constantly breaking down. Mainly due to lighting. In my case a gate would be easy to go around. As it is, my sensor is fairly well hidden so incoming traffic always passes by.

With the POE: I'm running fiber and some size of power cord. Is the transformer for the poe plugged in at the house? There will also need to be power for the fiber converter at camera. Can both the camera and the converter use the same poe?

I've looked for a user manual online for the ptz camera but haven't found one. I'd like to see what other connections, such as the alarm trigger requires.

 

[nayr]

power wont go down fiber, you'll have to inject power after the media converter.

the alarm connectors are just bare wires.. they are open collector inputs, short them to ground and they activate.

 

[seez52]

power wont go down fiber, you'll have to inject power after the media converter.

the alarm connectors are just bare wires.. they are open collector inputs, short them to ground and they activate.

The POE transformer I'm guessing is 120VAC, so am I going to have to run that to the camera so I can plug in a wall wart? I was hoping I might be able to run some kind of direct power line without having a wall wart on the camera end. If I've got to run 120VAC that far it's going to need to be a decent sized wire.

Basically I'll need power for the camera (specs show max of 23 watts) and power for the fiber to Ethernet converter. Can't imagine that takes that much current.

Good news on the alarm wires, sounds like I can probably utilize the existing 22ga wires for those.

 

[nayr]

Power the camera and the the media converter off the same power supply, the'll both take 12v direct..

if we could get power over ethernet to work 1k feet this would be a piece of cake.. for distance like this AC is your only option really.

 

[fenderman]

If you dont want to dig, you might consider something like this. http://www.nvt.com/content.php?type=product&key=eo2&cid=root
Your 22 wire may be just enough for it to operate at your distance. Contact the company to find out. They are expensive though..

 

[nayr]

thats a nice piece of kit, remember you need two of em too :nuts:

 

[fenderman]

thats a nice piece of kit, remember you need two of em too :nuts:

yeah, and its not as ideal as running cable....at that price I would expect it to work, but who knows..