New setup
- Thread starter MonkeeMadness
- Start date
fenderman
Staff member
- Mar 9, 2014
- 36,892
- 21,408
Yes but you know exactly where a random website gets it's gear from...it takes 10 minutes to build a website like that. Like I said putting place of purchase aside, you don't want to do any work.
I agree it would be a mistake and is what I’m trying to avoid. I know the advice on here makes sense and trying to stick with it.
You’re very wrong but maybe it has come across like that. I’ve been searching and speaking to many resellers.
I’ll try and phrase my questions better going forward.
I am, just hasn’t come across that way. Is what I’m after, install will be easy I just don’t want to end up with £1000 worth of kit which is wrong/not compatible.
looney2ns
IPCT Contributor
J Sigmo
Known around here
- Feb 5, 2018
- 996
- 1,336
You have to understand that many of the folks on this site have been here for years. So they can get a little "short" and be blunt because they've answered the same questions and seen the exact same threads over and over.
This is why the easy way for us to answer someone who is just getting started is to point them to the Wiki and the Cliff Notes.
When I first started setting up a security camera system, I wanted to impulse-buy everything and get it set up immediately. As a result, I bought a bunch of cameras that I really wish I could trade now for better units.
In the end, it has taken me almost a year to figure out what I want, and get things slowly set up right.
The sad fact is that to do this right, you will need to learn quite a bit. Most of the packaged systems that you can buy off the shelf will be unsecure and expose your network to outside attack, and likely not do what you want in the long run. So people here want to save you money and grief, and, in the long-run, labor and effort.
But it seems discouraging at first, because you can't just have what you want immediately and easily.
Don't be discouraged. Slow down, give up on the idea that this will be quick and incredibly easy. It won't.
But the good news is that you can avoid the mistakes many of us have made. And that will save you time, money, and effort in the long run.
There are a lot of details that are non-trivial in setting up a cam system that will be good, reliable, do what you really want, and not expose your network to easy attack.
If you are willing to accept that this will require a lot of knowledge, and are willing to take the time necessary to do that learning, then you really can build a do-it-yourself system that is better than what you could buy off the shelf or have installed professionally by many companies.
It's like being told that you can't open your Christmas presents until after new years, and you have to do your homework before you can have dessert. Believe me, I know!
But hang in there, and take your time. You won't have your system up and running as fast as you thought you would before you found this forum. I feel your disappointment. I really do!
But you will get what you want in good time. And it'll be something you are happy with and proud of.
Don't be put off by the short answers or impatience we sometimes have here. You're the thousandth person who has asked the same sequence of questions. So people tend to do a face-palm, and be curt at times.
But I do understand exactly where you are and what you'd like to see. A nice step-by-step guide to setting up the perfect system quickly and as cheaply as possible.
We'll work with you. There just isn't any one-size-fits-all answer, unfortunately. So this will be more work than any of us would like. But it's a pretty interesting and fun project for most of us.
Take your time and enjoy, and dont give up yet.
This is why the easy way for us to answer someone who is just getting started is to point them to the Wiki and the Cliff Notes.
When I first started setting up a security camera system, I wanted to impulse-buy everything and get it set up immediately. As a result, I bought a bunch of cameras that I really wish I could trade now for better units.
In the end, it has taken me almost a year to figure out what I want, and get things slowly set up right.
The sad fact is that to do this right, you will need to learn quite a bit. Most of the packaged systems that you can buy off the shelf will be unsecure and expose your network to outside attack, and likely not do what you want in the long run. So people here want to save you money and grief, and, in the long-run, labor and effort.
But it seems discouraging at first, because you can't just have what you want immediately and easily.
Don't be discouraged. Slow down, give up on the idea that this will be quick and incredibly easy. It won't.
But the good news is that you can avoid the mistakes many of us have made. And that will save you time, money, and effort in the long run.
There are a lot of details that are non-trivial in setting up a cam system that will be good, reliable, do what you really want, and not expose your network to easy attack.
If you are willing to accept that this will require a lot of knowledge, and are willing to take the time necessary to do that learning, then you really can build a do-it-yourself system that is better than what you could buy off the shelf or have installed professionally by many companies.
It's like being told that you can't open your Christmas presents until after new years, and you have to do your homework before you can have dessert. Believe me, I know!
But hang in there, and take your time. You won't have your system up and running as fast as you thought you would before you found this forum. I feel your disappointment. I really do!
But you will get what you want in good time. And it'll be something you are happy with and proud of.
Don't be put off by the short answers or impatience we sometimes have here. You're the thousandth person who has asked the same sequence of questions. So people tend to do a face-palm, and be curt at times.
But I do understand exactly where you are and what you'd like to see. A nice step-by-step guide to setting up the perfect system quickly and as cheaply as possible.
We'll work with you. There just isn't any one-size-fits-all answer, unfortunately. So this will be more work than any of us would like. But it's a pretty interesting and fun project for most of us.
Take your time and enjoy, and dont give up yet.
Last edited:
Thanks for your kind words and advice I appreciate your post.
I have taken first steps and have ordered a better router which has the built in capabilities of VPN and will allow better protection of network.
I will continue to read and work out what I believe I need to order and then post back here to check its sounds correct. The installation I believe will be the easier part of this project but if the equipment isn't right it means nothing.
I have taken first steps and have ordered a better router which has the built in capabilities of VPN and will allow better protection of network.
I will continue to read and work out what I believe I need to order and then post back here to check its sounds correct. The installation I believe will be the easier part of this project but if the equipment isn't right it means nothing.
J Sigmo
Known around here
- Feb 5, 2018
- 996
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I think that's a good first step. I'm very happy with an Asus router that runs OpenVPN, and allows me to access my home network securely from wherever I go. It was pretty easy to set up and has a lot of other features that I really like.
Also, I'll add my voice to those highly recommending setting up a dedicated PC to run Blue Iris rather than buying an NVR.
@fenderman showed me how to get a refurbished PC for fairly cheap and set it up right. Blue Iris is amazing, and the special web interface, UI3, written by another member of this forum, @bp2008, and now included with all new releases of BI, is fantastic, and you can use it through a browser from anywhere via your new router running OpenVPN!
When you get a POE switch to power and run your cameras, get a huge one. You can never have enough cameras! Hint: Eight is NOT enough.
Go ahead and ask about everything you are thinking of getting. People will have probably tried it all and be able to say whether or not they liked it.
Something like this would be super cool to run BI: https://www.intel.co.uk/content/www/uk/en/products/boards-kits/nuc/mini-pcs/nuc8i7hnkqc.html - Although I don't think released yet. Happy to have a dedicated PC but want a mini case so not massive and imposing.
Do people tend to hide their BI/NVRs? As would be very easy and to steal if inside the house (assuming near router/TV quite often). Also what about if someone kills the power to the house, I assume the thinking is the MicroSD footage would have enough.
Do people tend to hide their BI/NVRs? As would be very easy and to steal if inside the house (assuming near router/TV quite often). Also what about if someone kills the power to the house, I assume the thinking is the MicroSD footage would have enough.
fenderman
Staff member
- Mar 9, 2014
- 36,892
- 21,408
No you want a standard processor not laptop processors and room for proper local storage...
J Sigmo
Known around here
- Feb 5, 2018
- 996
- 1,336
I think many people do hide their NVRs, or set things up for some remote storage. They also like having SD cards in the cameras to provide backup storage in case the NVR gets stolen.
I haven't hidden anything, don't have backup storage, and dont have cards in any of my cameras...yet.
I like having the Blue Iris PC set up as an easy to use workstation, and have the space for it in an office. But it could get stolen, and that would suck! So off site backup storage or hiding it have crossed my mind.
I agree with @fenderman that a large desktop tower case is best so you can add hard drives easily since you will likely want additional storage. The small form factor PCs are attractive, but you can't easily add drives. And laptops tend to have processors that are not suited to decoding a lot of compressed video.
A refurbished business desktop tower PC is most recommended. And then put in a hard drive designed for video such as a Western Digital Purple. At fenderman's recommendation, I'm also going to install some SSDs to take the places of the stock mechanical primary hard drives in these machines, too.
And then you will want a good UPS to provide some run-time for power failures.
The refurb PCs I got have fancy power supplies with active power factor correction, and that's nice. But it also means you need a UPS with sine-wave output. So I got a new UPS for those PCs.
But the end result is very low power and a long run time on battery.
So the burglars can steal some nice PCs and a nice UPS when they hit me. I really do need to set up some sort of off-site or hidden or secured storage. But people sometimes stash NVRs, switches, etc., in attics or other places that are hard to reach and not climate-controlled. And electronics generally don't tolerate high temperatures. So keep that in mind.
I haven't hidden anything, don't have backup storage, and dont have cards in any of my cameras...yet.
I like having the Blue Iris PC set up as an easy to use workstation, and have the space for it in an office. But it could get stolen, and that would suck! So off site backup storage or hiding it have crossed my mind.
I agree with @fenderman that a large desktop tower case is best so you can add hard drives easily since you will likely want additional storage. The small form factor PCs are attractive, but you can't easily add drives. And laptops tend to have processors that are not suited to decoding a lot of compressed video.
A refurbished business desktop tower PC is most recommended. And then put in a hard drive designed for video such as a Western Digital Purple. At fenderman's recommendation, I'm also going to install some SSDs to take the places of the stock mechanical primary hard drives in these machines, too.
And then you will want a good UPS to provide some run-time for power failures.
The refurb PCs I got have fancy power supplies with active power factor correction, and that's nice. But it also means you need a UPS with sine-wave output. So I got a new UPS for those PCs.
But the end result is very low power and a long run time on battery.
So the burglars can steal some nice PCs and a nice UPS when they hit me. I really do need to set up some sort of off-site or hidden or secured storage. But people sometimes stash NVRs, switches, etc., in attics or other places that are hard to reach and not climate-controlled. And electronics generally don't tolerate high temperatures. So keep that in mind.
How much storage space do you tend to fill per camera/per day assuming 4k? I'm looking at 3-4 cameras in total for outside, with maybe possibility with some additional ones inside.
I currently have a high powered PC, which could easily handle BI... but dedicated would be better (already have NAS available for storage) - just the physical space is this issue. Will explore if I can find anything suitable.
In terms of storing in cloud, I guess you could store motion only and everything else local for a rolling period of time. There will have to be some compromise somewhere. My internet connection is pretty good, whilst you can't guarantee 100%, its downtime is minimal and risk I can accept. I also found mini UPS power sockets you can use to ensure your router is always on (well 30mins backup, which I think is adequate least for me) so least if some killed the power it will still be online for the event.
I currently have a high powered PC, which could easily handle BI... but dedicated would be better (already have NAS available for storage) - just the physical space is this issue. Will explore if I can find anything suitable.
In terms of storing in cloud, I guess you could store motion only and everything else local for a rolling period of time. There will have to be some compromise somewhere. My internet connection is pretty good, whilst you can't guarantee 100%, its downtime is minimal and risk I can accept. I also found mini UPS power sockets you can use to ensure your router is always on (well 30mins backup, which I think is adequate least for me) so least if some killed the power it will still be online for the event.
looney2ns
IPCT Contributor
If space is a concern, something like the SFF Dell optiplex is the ticket.
Very small, almost completely silent, and low energy use.
That's what I'm running BI on now for almost two years.
1 SSd and 1 4tb Purple, and I get 15 days of retention.
If my answers come off as curt, that's not my intention. I simply try to plow through as many post's as I can in my allotted time frame.
I spent almost 3 months on here before I purchased my first camera and Blue Iris.
For the most part, these two cameras are hard to beat.
Review-Dahua Starlight IPC-HDW5231R-ZE 800 meter capable ePOE
Review-Dahua IPC-HDW2231RP-ZS Starlight Camera-Varifocal
Very small, almost completely silent, and low energy use.
That's what I'm running BI on now for almost two years.
1 SSd and 1 4tb Purple, and I get 15 days of retention.
If my answers come off as curt, that's not my intention. I simply try to plow through as many post's as I can in my allotted time frame.
I spent almost 3 months on here before I purchased my first camera and Blue Iris.
For the most part, these two cameras are hard to beat.
Review-Dahua Starlight IPC-HDW5231R-ZE 800 meter capable ePOE
Review-Dahua IPC-HDW2231RP-ZS Starlight Camera-Varifocal