Pandemic threat? Anyone else concerned?

[Frankenscript]

If the new iPhone came out this week, I'm betting most people would have no problem getting in their car and waiting in line for hours. Can't be bothered to vote, though. Priorities.

This is a disingenuous over-generalization that misses the reality that many folks innlow income brackets face.

It also ignores the specific problem this year that voting may be extra difficult due to COVID-19.

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[Jessie.slimer]

This is a disingenuous over-generalization that misses the reality that many folks innlow income brackets face.

It also ignores the specific problem this year that voting may be extra difficult due to COVID-19.

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Not really. Low income people don't have cell phones? How did they get them? Not by mail. They likely drove to a store or had someone drive them to a store, where they waited in a line and most likely provided an ID to get their contract.

As @bigredfish said, everyone who wants to vote can vote. Nobody is locking them in a basement. They obviously manage to get places for food, everyday living supplies, don't they? Voting is just not high enough on their priority list. And that's fine. Just don't bitch at the results of the election if you couldn't be bothered to vote. And certainly don't claim that you were not allowed to vote, because that is ridiculous.

I live in the sticks and drive quite a ways to vote. Can I claim voter suppression?

 

[Frankenscript]

Not really. Low income people don't have cell phones? How did they get them? Not by mail. They likely drove to a store or had someone drive them to a store, where they waited in a line and most likely provided an ID to get their contract.

As @bigredfish said, everyone who wants to vote can vote. Nobody is locking them in a basement. They obviously manage to get places for food, everyday living supplies, don't they? Voting is just not high enough on their priority list. And that's fine. Just don't bitch at the results of the election if you couldn't be bothered to vote. And certainly don't claim that you were not allowed to vote, because that is ridiculous.

I live in the sticks and drive quite a ways to vote. Can I claim voter suppression?

Sure some poor folks get fancy phones. They are in the minority. Most poor folks I know have low end Androids that you get nearly for free or very old models from the used market. Who goes to a phone store these days anyway? I'm not poor but haven't been to a phone store in five years or more. I buy used phones on Swappa or order new ones for delivery once Ina while.

Anyway you are still missing the point that we can't expect polling locations to operate as normal this year. Even the primaries were disrupted and many polling locations had trouble finding workers due to safety concerns. We have to plan now for the possibility that some locations will not be able to do in person voting.

The election needs to move forward in a way that does not disenfranchise either rural or urban citizens, and making voting inconvenient is a form of disenfranchisement.

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[ctgoldwing]

My wife and I are both in our 70's. I am immunosuppressed. There is no way we are going to the polls to vote.

There are 100's of thousands of transplant patients, cancer patients etc that are at high risk. Should we just tell them to play Russian Roulette and go out to vote? There has been no credible evidence of any significant voter fraud by mail. Why would you want to make it harder for someone to vote?

 

[sebastiantombs]

Your last statement regarding fraud is mistaken. There have been multiple examples of voting fraud with mail in ballots across the country. Do you go to Walmart, Home Depot, Lowes, Target or any other store that is on the approved list? Like I said, let's make them polling places since they seem to have some kind of magic that makes them safe. I, too, am in the age group that you're in and am also immuno suppressed from cancer therapy. While I'm careful when going out, I still go out and interact with people in the stores, and the hospital which, to me, is a much higher risk situation than any store or polling place, without worrying myself to death about it. Then again, I check multiple liberal and conservative news sources daily rather than rely on CNBC, MSNBC, CNN, the rest of the lame stream media, Youtube, Twitter and Facebook for information. All of those are in the sewer any way.

I find it interesting that the media is harping on the 100,000 deaths number while totally ignoring how many have recovered, which is probably well over one million plus by now. It's the current number of infections, not the total infections, that is the biggest indicator of what's actually happening but none, and I mean NONE, of the media ever talks about that. Doesn't suit the hair on fire, we're all doomed, story line they love to promulgate.

 

[ctgoldwing]

Your last statement regarding fraud is mistaken. There have been multiple examples of voting fraud with mail in ballots across the country. Do you go to Walmart NO. Home Depot NO, Lowes NO, Target NO or any other store that is on the approved list NO? Like I said, let's make them polling places since they seem to have some kind of magic that makes them safe. I, too, am in the age group that you're in and am also immuno suppressed from cancer therapy. While I'm careful when going out, I still go out and interact with people in the stores, and the hospital which, to me, is a much higher risk situation than any store or polling place, without worrying myself to death about it. Then again, I check multiple liberal and conservative news sources daily rather than rely on CNBC, MSNBC, CNN, the rest of the lame stream media, Youtube, Twitter and Facebook for information. All of those are in the sewer any way.

I find it interesting that the media is harping on the 100,000 deaths number while totally ignoring how many have recovered, which is probably well over one million plus by now. It's the current number of infections, not the total infections, that is the biggest indicator of what's actually happening but none, and I mean NONE, of the media ever talks about that. Doesn't suit the hair on fire, we're all doomed, story line they love to promulgate.

I don't know, but I would assume there are some cases of mail in voter fraud. There hasn't been a significant number ever shown to me. What is the rate of voter fraud at the polling place?

Because some village idiot in Washington says so, doesn't make it so. Can you site some significant cases of voting fraud by mail for me? If its a real thing I sure would like to know it.

That you choose to go out now, that's fine. I hope you do fine. We all make our own choices, take risks by our own decisions. I rode a motorcycle for over 50 years, almost a million miles on 2 wheels. I understood the risks. I just don't want to take stupid risks (for me) that on the risk / reward scale are no brainers.

 

[sebastiantombs]

Just a few quick examples from one quick search. To say there is no voter fraud or the risk, with mail-in ballots is minimal, is just mis-stating the facts. If it happens once, it's far too often. The California example cited is the most egregious and involved multiple thousands of votes, mail-in style, that magically turned up days after the polls closed.

In New Jersey in 2013 -- not in 1813, 2013, a city councilman was caught paying operatives to go door to door telling people who to vote for and offering them $50 bucks. Texas as had multiple prosecutions for illegal vote harvesting.

In 2016, council member Guadalupe Rivera won a local election by 16 votes. Later, Rivera was convicted of illegally assisting people in filling out absentee ballots. According to the county clerk, ballot harvesting fraud involves political operatives who target and exploit the vulnerable -- often that means homebound individuals were too confused to realize their votes are being stolen.

In California, ballot harvesting is already almost totally unrestricted. In the midterms in 2018 officials in Orange County reported people dropping off hundreds of ballots at a time. 250,000 votes appeared from previously inactive voters.

From, of all places, MSN via CNN - What a West Virginia man says was a small, joking attempt at voter fraud shows just how closely officials are watching

1982
An estimated 100,000 fraudulent ballots were cast in a 1982 Chicago election. After a Justice Department investigation, 63 individuals were convicted of voter fraud, including vote buying, impersonation fraud, fictitious voter registrations, phony absentee ballots, and voting by non-citizens.

 

[ctgoldwing]

Just a few quick examples from one quick search. To say there is no voter fraud or the risk, with mail-in ballots is minimal, is just mis-stating the facts. If it happens once, it's far too often. The California example cited is the most egregious and involved multiple thousands of votes, mail-in style, that magically turned up days after the polls closed.

In New Jersey in 2013 -- not in 1813, 2013, a city councilman was caught paying operatives to go door to door telling people who to vote for and offering them $50 bucks. Texas as had multiple prosecutions for illegal vote harvesting.

In 2016, council member Guadalupe Rivera won a local election by 16 votes. Later, Rivera was convicted of illegally assisting people in filling out absentee ballots. According to the county clerk, ballot harvesting fraud involves political operatives who target and exploit the vulnerable -- often that means homebound individuals were too confused to realize their votes are being stolen.

In California, ballot harvesting is already almost totally unrestricted. In the midterms in 2018 officials in Orange County reported people dropping off hundreds of ballots at a time. 250,000 votes appeared from previously inactive voters.

From, of all places, MSN via CNN - What a West Virginia man says was a small, joking attempt at voter fraud shows just how closely officials are watching

1982
An estimated 100,000 fraudulent ballots were cast in a 1982 Chicago election. After a Justice Department investigation, 63 individuals were convicted of voter fraud, including vote buying, impersonation fraud, fictitious voter registrations, phony absentee ballots, and voting by non-citizens.

I see, so out of the billions of votes cast over the last 8 years this is the best you can come up with?
Have a great day!

 

[sebastiantombs]

Let's see 100, 000 votes in a local election is insignificant to you. Ok, whatever floats your boat.

 

[Jessie.slimer]

These are just documented cases. When I lived in the city, I remember just walking up, giving my name and address, and was given a ballot. No ID. I always thought how it would be possible for fraud to take place if it was known that a person would not be voting, died that year, etc. Just because its not in the news doesn't mean its not happening.

 

[Frankenscript]

Voter fraud is real and happens once in a while. But it's rare statistically, and cases where something odd happens do need to be investigated. Nobody is saying we should ignore the possibility of voter fraud by any means, whether it be in person a the polls or via tapered/invalid ballots. My point is that widescale disenfranchisement is a much more serious and real problem: people removed from polls without sufficient process, or voting rules / locations made relatively inaccessible to specific segments of the population. These things impact poor / urban / minority populations the most and skew the vote toward R.

The recent case in West Virginia and cited above (also reported widely via AP) is interesting in that it was a contract mail carrier that "as a joke" changed a number of ballot requests to Republican as well as making other alterations to those ballot requests. Note, this wasn't exactly vote tampering... it was tampering with ballot requests. Had the problem not been discovered, the people would have received incorrect ballots (for the wrong party) and been able to request new ones. The yokel who did it should be tossed in the slammer anyway.

But Trump in his usual unhinged lunatic way is doing whatever he can to get the narrative away from the fact that our pandemic response was too little too late, at a grievous cost. There's no coincidence here; he's ginning up his faithful on this topic to distract from the 100k milestone. @sebastiantombs you are right there are a lot of recovered cases (right now, 494,724 out of 1,758,821 total clinical cases per worldometers). Note that not all of these are "back to normal" even if they are recovered. Recovered just means out of the hospital and no longer infectious for a certain period of time. The rate of clinical cases having persistent, possibly permanent damage from the virus is significant. I've seen estimates from 2% to 10%; take you pick. Most of these are either damaged lungs or damage due to clots including strokes and other circulatory issues.

Saw this morning that big baby is upset with social media and twitter in particular for calling out his lies. Tiny violin, playing just for him.

 

[sebastiantombs]

Here in the Great Nanny State, governed by Commissar Murphy, we've always had to sign and the signature is compared, visually, to the signature given when registering. Fairly fool proof, although fools can be so creative.

We have seen "wholesale" voting fraud and mail-in ballots on a grand scale will hav that same result. Anyone that doesn't think it will happen needs to rethink what's going on.

 

[StratRider]

My wife and I are both in our 70's. I am immunosuppressed. There is no way we are going to the polls to vote.
There are 100's of thousands of transplant patients, cancer patients etc that are at high risk. Should we just tell them to play Russian Roulette and go out to vote? There has been no credible evidence of any significant voter fraud by mail. Why would you want to make it harder for someone to vote?

You are being intentionally obtuse and feigning ignorance of absentee ballot procedure.
Anyone that expresses a need to vote by mail is allowed to do so by asking for their ballot to be mailed to them.
Just being over 65 is a qualifier. Not to mention that the election is still over 5 months away.
The key is that YOU have to make some effort if you want to be treated special.
Just mailing ballots to everyone is asking for abuse in many ways that I could get into but you likely already know what they are if you pay any attention at all.
There is video of MANY democrat leaders saying how mail in voting has been abused - but now they don't because they have found a better way to cheat with ballot harvesting and forgery.
Imagine every single abuse of mail in ballots is an extra vote for Trump - still sound like a good plan?

 

[bigredfish]

I'll just leave this here.... and once again for the slow learners, please pay attention to the cited sources instead of attacking the website reporting it

Sorry, Twitter, But Trump Is Right About Mail-In Ballots

 

[juliand]

and so was armalite...

 

[Frankenscript]

If this doesn't convince you that Trump is a dangerous lunatic, nothing will. Here, I even quote your favorite source:

Trump signs social media executive order that calls for removal of liability protections over 'censoring'

Flanked by Attorney General Bill Barr, President Trump signed an executive order in the Oval Office on Thursday that interprets Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act of 1996 (CDA) as not providing provide statutory liability protections for tech companies that engage in censorship and...

www.foxnews.com

 

[bigredfish]

About time, if they are going to selectively censor content they dont deserve liability protections..

(Fox is not my favorite source, but better than most of the rest of the MSM)

 

[StratRider]

Let's see 100, 000 votes in a local election is insignificant to you. Ok, whatever floats your boat.

it took way less than that to give Al Frankin the win years back. This was a huge case of voter fraud - he won by 218 votes. You can still google this one.

 

[sdkid]

Voter fraud is real and happens once in a while. But it's rare statistically, and cases where something odd happens do need to be investigated. Nobody is saying we should ignore the possibility of voter fraud by any means, whether it be in person a the polls or via tapered/invalid ballots. My point is that widescale disenfranchisement is a much more serious and real problem: people removed from polls without sufficient process, or voting rules / locations made relatively inaccessible to specific segments of the population. These things impact poor / urban / minority populations the most and skew the vote toward R.

How about the California push to mail ballots to EVERY REGISTERED VOTER whether they want one or not? Those are legal ballots that can be used to vote. LA County alone had 115% of the population registered to vote. That is a shit-ton of ballots for people who are no longer residents or who don't even exist, because, you know-- they DIED. That is a shit ton of opportunities for voter fraud. I am amazed at how the DNC and liberals want "election security" but continually dismiss these kinds of sloppy database management situations or the need for voter ID. WTF? The only conclusion that can be drawn is that they recognize that THEY will be the benefactors of that fraud, and they don't care.

It took a LAWSUIT to FORCE the County of Los Angeles to purge the voter registration roles of DEAD PEOPLE and those who MOVED. WTF-- it takes a LAWSUIT to do that? BTW--- that voter registration purge was characterized as an attack on voting rights of POC by liberal media-- and they Failed to mention there were more voters registered than there were actual Residents of the county. Yup--- it's all a crooked conservative plot to disenfranchise. Bullshit.

 

[sdkid]

If this doesn't convince you that Trump is a dangerous lunatic, nothing will. Here, I even quote your favorite source:

Trump signs social media executive order that calls for removal of liability protections over 'censoring'

Flanked by Attorney General Bill Barr, President Trump signed an executive order in the Oval Office on Thursday that interprets Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act of 1996 (CDA) as not providing provide statutory liability protections for tech companies that engage in censorship and...

www.foxnews.com

How is STOPPING a social media company from selectively restricting speech a bad thing? Trump's "regulation" is to get these companies to STOP REGULATING the speech of others.