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hmjgriffon said:
Nice, that's not bad at ALL, 2 disks is fine, the WD purple's are pretty cheap, I'll have to decide how long I want to keep recordings for, I'm thinking probably only a week at absolute most but we will see how much drive that requires. Hell I'm willing to spend a grand on the system if it will handle all of the cameras easily. I dunno if you can get a beefier CPU setup though without going dual CPU's on a server board haha.
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The 6700k is a bit beefier but not worth the extra cost...though if you want to wait there are new kaby lake desktop processors coming...
Keep watching ebay....look for best offer deals and offer 400-450...
if you are buying new cameras, take a strong look at the dahua startlight turret 1080p thread...they are MUCH better than the 3mp/4mp cameras...
 
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fenderman said:
The 6700k is a bit beefier but not worth the extra cost...though if you want to wait there are new kaby lake desktop processors coming...
Keep watching ebay....look for best offer deals and offer 400-450...
if you are buying new cameras, take a strong look at the dahua startlight turret 1080p thread...they are MUCH better than the 3mp/4mp cameras...
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This one? Dahua Starlight Varifocal Turret (IPC-HDW5231R-Z) I'm interested, I've currently got 1 4mm fixed 3mp hikvision bullet cam i've had a while, 2 3mp hikvision verifocal bullet cams, and I just picked up the 3mp cube which I am absolutely loving, the PIR has not had a false positive yet. Was going to replace the current cam in the livingroom with one and add another in another area of the house to cover the front and back doors and windows at the center of the house. I am totally open to other cameras, I will definitely check those out. At some point i'd also like a nice ptz camera to put outside, maybe on the roof just to play around with in the neighborhood, haha.
 
hmjgriffon said:
This one? Dahua Starlight Varifocal Turret (IPC-HDW5231R-Z) I'm interested, I've currently got 1 4mm fixed 3mp hikvision bullet cam i've had a while, 2 3mp hikvision verifocal bullet cams, and I just picked up the 3mp cube which I am absolutely loving, the PIR has not had a false positive yet. Was going to replace the current cam in the livingroom with one and add another in another area of the house to cover the front and back doors and windows at the center of the house. I am totally open to other cameras, I will definitely check those out. At some point i'd also like a nice ptz camera to put outside, maybe on the roof just to play around with in the neighborhood, haha.
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Yes. The cube will not have strong enough IR for outdoors...unless you plan on adding some or light...the varifocal is nice as well. The low light performance will be MUCH better with the starlight...
25 cams for the house seems like total overkill though...:)
 
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fenderman said:
Yes. The cube will not have strong enough IR for outdoors...unless you plan on adding some or light...the varifocal is nice as well. The low light performance will be MUCH better with the starlight...
25 cams for the house seems like total overkill though...:)
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I will probably never have that many, BUT, that is the way I like to build things out, over engineered and over powered JUST IN CASE I decide to go nuts and keep putting more cameras up all over the place. For instance, maybe somehow having a couple cameras that could capture license plate pictures of all of the cars that drive by the house during the day, don't need LPR, but if something went down I could look around that time code and maybe get a plate of a perp. Who knows. So I figured if I build a system that can handle 20, maybe 25 cams I should be covered for a good long while, or until really high mp cameras become cheap enough. If a $500 computer would handle that with some HD upgrades I'm good with that. I'm gonna look into the dahua's and look at more computers. I agree with you, I stopped building computers many years ago, it's not worth it unless you have a specific set of requirements but you can definitely buy them cheaper than you can build them. It looks like as long as I have a beefy cpu and nice onboard video for hardware acceleration I should be good to go, and plenty of hd space of course. Even SSD's are getting down there in price but probably not enough for video surveillance.
 
hmjgriffon said:
I will probably never have that many, BUT, that is the way I like to build things out, over engineered and over powered JUST IN CASE I decide to go nuts and keep putting more cameras up all over the place. For instance, maybe somehow having a couple cameras that could capture license plate pictures of all of the cars that drive by the house during the day, don't need LPR, but if something went down I could look around that time code and maybe get a plate of a perp. Who knows. So I figured if I build a system that can handle 20, maybe 25 cams I should be covered for a good long while, or until really high mp cameras become cheap enough. If a $500 computer would handle that with some HD upgrades I'm good with that. I'm gonna look into the dahua's and look at more computers. I agree with you, I stopped building computers many years ago, it's not worth it unless you have a specific set of requirements but you can definitely buy them cheaper than you can build them. It looks like as long as I have a beefy cpu and nice onboard video for hardware acceleration I should be good to go, and plenty of hd space of course. Even SSD's are getting down there in price but probably not enough for video surveillance.
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Honestly, I would buy an i5/i7 skylake and dont overbuild...you can likely do more than fine with a 300 i5-6500...by the time you add more cams or the high res cams get decent night vision at a reasonable price there will be newer, faster more efficient processors...
I would use an SSD for the os...the mx300 by crucial is about 70 dollars for a 275gb....
 
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fenderman said:
Honestly, I would buy an i5/i7 skylake and dont overbuild...you can likely do more than fine with a 300 i5-6500...by the time you add more cams or the high res cams get decent night vision at a reasonable price there will be newer, faster more efficient processors...
I would use an SSD for the os...the mx300 by crucial is about 70 dollars for a 275gb....
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You mean night vision like IR light with filter, or like legit night vision cameras because I think those run a couple grand each right now lol.
 
hmjgriffon said:
You mean night vision like IR light with filter, or like legit night vision cameras because I think those run a couple grand each right now lol.
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with ir or some supplemental lighting...the starlight is extremely good in color mode even with a bit of light...its MUCH MUCH better than standard 3mp cameras.
 
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fenderman said:
with ir or some supplemental lighting...the starlight is extremely good in color mode even with a bit of light...its MUCH MUCH better than standard 3mp cameras.
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Yeah I finally looked through the entire thread, very much nicer looking picture than the 4mp, though he never compared it to say, a 3mp hikvision lol.
 
hmjgriffon said:
Yeah I finally looked through the entire thread, very much nicer looking picture than the 4mp, though he never compared it to say, a 3mp hikvision lol.
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It's much better than the 3mp...The 4mp was actually better in low light than the 3...It's not even close....The difference is dramatic..
 
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fenderman said:
Its not even close..the dahua is a much much better camera in low light and at night...the starlights are in a completely different league.
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What about during the day though. I was looking around earlier at the prices on 4mp hikvisions they've come down a lot on the varifocal models. Is it worth taking the hit in resolution in normal lighting to get the awesome night time lighting? Has anyone reviews 3 or 4 mp starlight dahuas? That would seem to be best of all worlds. :D
 
hmjgriffon said:
What about during the day though. I was looking around earlier at the prices on 4mp hikvisions they've come down a lot on the varifocal models. Is it worth taking the hit in resolution in normal lighting to get the awesome night time lighting? Has anyone reviews 3 or 4 mp starlight dahuas? That would seem to be best of all worlds. :D
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The difference is negligible...4mp is not double the pixles per inch as 2mp...hikvision does not have a turret varifocal and most are not motorized, which is a huge pain to install. Dont mess with domes or bullets...you will have spider web and ir reflection issues.
There are no cheap 3mp or 4mp starlight cameras if any.
I would not buy another hikvision or dahua standard camera when there is a cheap 170 superb camera available that is exceptional in low light.
The resolution game is a marketing gimmick for suckers...the 1080p varifocal will have the same effective pixel count as a 3mp/4mp fixed camera if you zoom in not a non standard size like 5/7mm...
 
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fenderman said:
The difference is negligible...4mp is not double the pixles per inch as 2mp...hikvision does not have a turret varifocal and most are not motorized, which is a huge pain to install. Dont mess with domes or bullets...you will have spider web and ir reflection issues.
There are no cheap 3mp or 4mp starlight cameras if any.
I would not buy another hikvision or dahua standard camera when there is a cheap 170 superb camera available that is exceptional in low light.
The resolution game is a marketing gimmick for suckers...the 1080p varifocal will have the same effective pixel count as a 3mp/4mp fixed camera if you zoom in not a non standard size like 5/7mm...
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Makes sense to me, I am not beholden to any brand or number. I happen to have 3 bullets but 2 of them are varifocal because I really hate the idea of fixed lenses, problem was when I bought them varifocal was expensive af. I've experienced the spider problem with bullets outdoors, haha. I had scheduled a camera maintenance once a month to take care of it, I'm really liking the idea of the turret cameras, I wish the dahua had a hookup for motion sensor, that is the ONLY think it seems to be missing. I'm gonna buy one to play with when the price changes to 170 like the Andy guy said I think. Better make sure my allieexpress account is still good, I've only bought one thing from there a long time ago.
 
There is no real need to wait for Kaby Lake CPUs (i7-7700K etc) as they are basically the same as Skylake, only slightly higher clock speeds out of the box. i7-6700 will be plenty for 25 cameras in Blue Iris as long as you use hardware acceleration and direct to disk recording. Dual socket servers are also unnecessary, because they cost way more and you lose hardware acceleration so the capabilities aren't actually much better -- maybe even worse -- and certainly less energy efficient.

If you have a lot of lighting then starlight cameras aren't actually that much better than others. I have a lot of cameras on my house so the IR from all of them gets combined along with the powerful illuminator I have, and my starlights don't do much better than the older cams as a result. Starlight should do much better when it is the only camera looking at an area :)
 
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bp2008 said:
There is no real need to wait for Kaby Lake CPUs (i7-7700K etc) as they are basically the same as Skylake, only slightly higher clock speeds out of the box. i7-6700 will be plenty for 25 cameras in Blue Iris as long as you use hardware acceleration and direct to disk recording. Dual socket servers are also unnecessary, because they cost way more and you lose hardware acceleration so the capabilities aren't actually much better -- maybe even worse -- and certainly less energy efficient.

If you have a lot of lighting then starlight cameras aren't actually that much better than others. I have a lot of cameras on my house so the IR from all of them gets combined along with the powerful illuminator I have, and my starlights don't do much better than the older cams as a result. Starlight should do much better when it is the only camera looking at an area :)
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I believe I read that there is a 12.5 percent power consumption reduction...not really that big considering it amounts to 3-5w but something...
The starlights are better regardless of additional lighting...you can see that in the examples posted by nayr...the image is much more crisp, less noise and you can often set them to day mode without a ton of motion blue like the standard 3/4mp cameras...the varifocal starlights are worth every penny of the 170...Also consider the cost and eyesore (though that is obviously not a concern for you :) )of buying, installing and running extra illuminators...
 
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fenderman said:
Also consider the cost and eyesore (though that is obviously not a concern for you :) )of buying, installing and running extra illuminators...
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Thats right! I could not stand to live in a cookie cutter house in an HOA neighborhood where everything needs to meet someone else's cosmetic standards.
 
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hmjgriffon said:
Makes sense to me, I am not beholden to any brand or number. I happen to have 3 bullets but 2 of them are varifocal because I really hate the idea of fixed lenses, problem was when I bought them varifocal was expensive af. I've experienced the spider problem with bullets outdoors, haha. I had scheduled a camera maintenance once a month to take care of it, I'm really liking the idea of the turret cameras, I wish the dahua had a hookup for motion sensor, that is the ONLY think it seems to be missing. I'm gonna buy one to play with when the price changes to 170 like the Andy guy said I think. Better make sure my allieexpress account is still good, I've only bought one thing from there a long time ago.
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A Varifocal Starlight Bullet is going to become available shortly, it supports external Alarm Input so if you want to hook a physical motion sensor directly up to it you can.. performance will be identical to the Varifocal Turret. IPC-HFW5231E-Z | Dahua Technology

There is a 16mm Varifocal Bullet in 6MP thats better than all the 3/4/8MP Cameras with its IMX178, its not low enough lux for dahua to call it a starlight.. but its roughly as good in low light as a decent non-starlight 1080p, but at 6MP.. its really the ONLY UHD camera that even does well in low light conditions right now, but it price is over $300 a piece so its not for for the faint of heart and its still not close to the performance of the 2MP Starlights (0.02 Lux vs 0.006 Lux): IPC-HFW8630E-Z | Dahua Technology. I think its a good candidate for LPR use, it is a case where more pixels and less noise can really help automatic plate reading, and because plates are very well litup at night.
 
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bp2008 said:
There is no real need to wait for Kaby Lake CPUs (i7-7700K etc) as they are basically the same as Skylake, only slightly higher clock speeds out of the box. i7-6700 will be plenty for 25 cameras in Blue Iris as long as you use hardware acceleration and direct to disk recording. Dual socket servers are also unnecessary, because they cost way more and you lose hardware acceleration so the capabilities aren't actually much better -- maybe even worse -- and certainly less energy efficient.

If you have a lot of lighting then starlight cameras aren't actually that much better than others. I have a lot of cameras on my house so the IR from all of them gets combined along with the powerful illuminator I have, and my starlights don't do much better than the older cams as a result. Starlight should do much better when it is the only camera looking at an area :)
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Yeah so I was not planning to wait I was going to get the HP fender man suggested and throw an SSD in it and a WD people or two. I'll have to see if your camera's are in your profile I'm curious what else you run. I don't have any stand alone IR illuminators but that may be a consideration in the future. I'm mostly interested in varifocal cameras though because I really hate the idea of not being able to tweak the focal length at that's one thing that really appeals to me about the dahuas, do you run any other comparable verafocal cameras? I've currently got two hikvision bullets and one 4mm, and a 2.8mm cube but I don't like the 2.8 FL even inside, it's decent, the pair is awesome though, I want to use PIR for all motion detection.
 
nayr said:
A Varifocal Starlight Bullet is going to become available shortly, it supports external Alarm Input so if you want to hook a physical motion sensor directly up to it you can.. performance will be identical to the Varifocal Turret. IPC-HFW5231E-Z | Dahua Technology

There is a 16mm Varifocal Bullet in 6MP thats better than all the 3/4/8MP Cameras with its IMX178, its not low enough lux for dahua to call it a starlight.. but its roughly as good in low light as a decent non-starlight 1080p, but at 6MP.. its really the ONLY UHD camera that even does well in low light conditions right now, but it price is over $300 a piece so its for for the faint of heart and its still not close to the performance of the 2MP Starlights (0.02 Lux vs 0.006 Lux): IPC-HFW8630E-Z | Dahua Technology. I think its a good candidate for LPR use, it is a case where more pixels and less noise can really help automatic plate reading; because plates are very well litup at night.
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I may wait for those bullets then, I'm really hooked on PIR after experiencing the hell that is software motion detection and then a camera with PIR, do you have any idea what the price will be for the bullets? Hopefully not much more, maybe that's a question for Andy on price and availability. I should be ordering the HP desktop soon.
 
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