REVIEW: Budget 4MP Turret Comparison - IPC-T2431T-AS vs Chinese HDW4433C-A

[EMPIRETECANDY]

Attenion

This model has some important update, guys can visit this link to make update.

IPC-T2431T-AS New firmware IPC-HX25(8)XX-Molec_MultiLang_PN_V2.800.0000000.10.R.191123.zip

Hi guys, Dahua has some new update for this camera. Please use the dropbox link in the attached file to download and flash, dahua has too many NEW series, the firmware names are very simliar, so if use any wrong file to update will kill the camera, please follow the list that we post here to...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[JonSnow]

what are some of the proper settings in camera firmware for optimal blue iris setup for this camera.

 

[Bratek]

Hello,
I noticed that DORI distance parameters for a new 2431 (1/3" 4 Mpix) is much better then 2231 (1/2.8" 2 Mpix), examples for bullet versions:
IPC-HFW2431S-S-S2

https://www.dahuasecurity.com/ceen/products/productDetail/36267

Lens	Detect	Observe	Recognize	Identify
2.8 mm	56 m (183.73 ft)	22.4 m (73.49 ft)	11.2 m (36.75 ft)	5.6 m (18.37 ft)

IPC-HFW2231S-S-S2

https://www.dahuasecurity.com/ceen/products/productDetail/36687

Lens	Detect	Observe	Recognize	Identify
2.8 mm	38.6 m (126.6 ft)	15.4 m (50.5 ft)	7.7 m (25.3 ft)	3.9 m (12.8 ft)

How do you explain this?
While everybody says that the 1/2.8" 2231 is generall (and especial in low light) better than 1/3" 2431 ?
It's my first post here, I'm looking for some budget solution, cheers,

 

[aristobrat]

DORI distances come from pixel density (usually measured in PPF <pixels per feet> or PPM <pixels per meter>. This page does an OK job explaining it:

Pixel Density, PPM and PPF in Video Surveillance

More pixels (i.e. 4MP vs 2MP) usually helps with DORI distances and I think help explains why the 4MP model has better DORI specs than the 2MP. Keep in mind that most folks here would recommend a PPF value of 100+ to ID someone you don't know. Dahua's DORI "Identify" distance is set for 80 PPF, if I recall correctly, so most here would consider them somewhat overstated. Another thing that can help DORI distances is the lens. 2.8mm lens usually have the lowest DORI values. As that number increases (i.e. 3.6-6mm), the DORI values should increase (with the tradeoff being that the image width decreases).

To get a rough idea of how cameras compare in low-light, one way is to compare their Min. Illumination lines from the spec sheets. The lower the number, usually the better the camera does in low light. So looking below, it seems like the 2231 should do noticeably better in low light.
2231 (1/2.8"): 0.002 Lux
2431 (1/3"): 0.008 Lux

In my opinion, the 2MP 1/2.8" image sensor, while older, was the best affordable low-light image sensor until a few months ago when the 4MP 1/1.8" image sensor came out. There are now some newer low-light image sensors (like this new 1/3" one in the 2431) that don't seem to do as well as the 2MP 1/2.8", but they're getting closer than they have before.

 

[bigredfish]

Explained exceptionally well above.

Is the 4MP DORI better than the 2MP in the daytime? Probably. Most any decent 4MP-8MP camera will be better in the daylight.

Nighttime low light is what most of us are concerned about. Most Bad Things (tm) happen at night

 

[JonSnow]

So better to use the HDW2431 on the porch/driveway since there are street lights and use the HFW2231S for the backyard?

 

[EMPIRETECANDY]

So better to use the HDW2431 on the porch/driveway since there are street lights and use the HFW2231S for the backyard?

Based on the distance , if The druve way 10-20 feet use a 3.6mm is good. If not use a motorized lens always easy for capturing better pics day and night.

 

[essjay]

I like the look of these for an over view cam, IE. have these mounted under the gutters in the two story house watching a wide area (just to see where some goes or what they do) with complimentary 5442/5231's lower down to catch faces.

 

[youscott]

Anyone use this camera? Thoughts?

 

[KCO]

DORI distances come from pixel density (usually measured in PPF <pixels per feet> or PPM <pixels per meter>. This page does an OK job explaining it:

Pixel Density, PPM and PPF in Video Surveillance

More pixels (i.e. 4MP vs 2MP) usually helps with DORI distances and I think help explains why the 4MP model has better DORI specs than the 2MP. Keep in mind that most folks here would recommend a PPF value of 100+ to ID someone you don't know. Dahua's DORI "Identify" distance is set for 80 PPF, if I recall correctly, so most here would consider them somewhat overstated. Another thing that can help DORI distances is the lens. 2.8mm lens usually have the lowest DORI values. As that number increases (i.e. 3.6-6mm), the DORI values should increase (with the tradeoff being that the image width decreases).

To get a rough idea of how cameras compare in low-light, one way is to compare their Min. Illumination lines from the spec sheets. The lower the number, usually the better the camera does in low light. So looking below, it seems like the 2231 should do noticeably better in low light.
2231 (1/2.8"): 0.002 Lux
2431 (1/3"): 0.008 Lux

In my opinion, the 2MP 1/2.8" image sensor, while older, was the best affordable low-light image sensor until a few months ago when the 4MP 1/1.8" image sensor came out. There are now some newer low-light image sensors (like this new 1/3" one in the 2431) that don't seem to do as well as the 2MP 1/2.8", but they're getting closer than they have before.

Which cameras have 4MP 1/1.8 " ?
What do you think of IPC-HDW2231TM-AS-S2, for me there is nothing better for that price

 

[8urt0]

Which cameras have 4MP 1/1.8 " ?
What do you think of IPC-HDW2231TM-AS-S2, for me there is nothing better for that price

I did a search and found it on aliexpress for $63.12 USD (sure you could do better with some research) seems pretty good for a camera with 0.002 min lux. I am no expert but I always thought getting good quality low light images with less motion blur pretty much all came down to the min lux? I know people talk about sensor size as that lets the light in so the bigger the sensor the better but a 1/2.8” sensor with 0.002 min lux surely this seems like a clear budget winner. Looking forward to hearing from some experts on this.

 

[katalyst]

This one is very interesting to me as well. I think i'm down to deciding between this IPC-T2431T-AS ($85US) or the IPC-T2231T-ZS ($130US and out of stock).

The 2231 gets me a varifocal lens, while with the 2431 will need to pick a sensor size (with some research). Other than then having a 2mp or 4mp, what other differences should i be aware of.

3 of them will be under the awnings and 1 attached to the side of the house.

Thanks if anyone can provide any help or other suggestions.

 

[essjay]

This one is very interesting to me as well. I think i'm down to deciding between this IPC-T2431T-AS ($85US) or the IPC-T2231T-ZS ($130US and out of stock).

The 2231 gets me a varifocal lens, while with the 2431 will need to pick a sensor size (with some research). Other than then having a 2mp or 4mp, what other differences should i be aware of.

3 of them will be under the awnings and 1 attached to the side of the house.

Thanks if anyone can provide any help or other suggestions.

If you want to save money, buy a single 2231T-ZS now and test mount it in each of your locations. Record what zoom you use in each of these positions. If you are happy with zooms between 2.8mm and 6mm, then buy the 2431's with those lenses. If you need more than 6mm, you'll need the 2231.

 

[katalyst]

If you want to save money, buy a single 2231T-ZS now and test mount it in each of your locations. Record what zoom you use in each of these positions. If you are happy with zooms between 2.8mm and 6mm, then buy the 2431's with those lenses. If you need more than 6mm, you'll need the 2231.

Thanks essjay. Are my differences about the only ones? I guess overall i need wider FoV at the front and back of house, and narrower down the sides. Pretty much these 2 cameras that fit the bill for low cost and good quality. With the more expensive 2231T cost mostly being in having to be vari-focal?

 

[8urt0]

Am I correct in saying people say buy a vari focal so you can get the correct field of view to maximise pixels per inch or so but in saying this each camera tells you the specs so you can see the for example the horizontal field of view and know where your mounting it so doesn’t this eliminate the use of a VR camera ??

 

[adamdylan]

Am I correct in saying people say buy a vari focal so you can get the correct field of view to maximise pixels per inch or so but in saying this each camera tells you the specs so you can see the for example the horizontal field of view and know where your mounting it so doesn’t this eliminate the use of a VR camera ??

Hi Burt.... Aways best to test!.... Mr D put it well in his reply to post Varifocal Vs Fixed when he said :

I bought a 5231R-Z varifocal starlight first and have used it as a tester camera. Between that and my DSLR, I got a pretty good idea what focal lengths I'd need in what places. I discovered that I'll need a mix of 3.6 mm and 6 mm lenses with maybe just one 2.8 mm. I wouldn't have guessed that to be the case before doing the testing.

 

[aristobrat]

I guess overall i need wider FoV at the front and back of house, and narrower down the sides. Pretty much these 2 cameras that fit the bill for low cost and good quality. With the more expensive 2231T cost mostly being in having to be vari-focal?

Don't forget that as the FOV angle increases, the pixels per foot (PPF) value decreases which makes being able to ID someone more difficult. Wider FOV cameras are great for getting overviews (ie most of the front yard in one image), but hard to ID with unless someone gets close to the camera. It’s not unusual to see folks start with wide FOV cameras and then go back and add additional ones with tighter FOV on important areas like porches, driveways, gates to backyard, etc.

And yes to the varifocal model costing more because of the varifocal lens.

 

[aristobrat]

Am I correct in saying people say buy a vari focal so you can get the correct field of view to maximise pixels per inch or so but in saying this each camera tells you the specs so you can see the for example the horizontal field of view and know where your mounting it so doesn’t this eliminate the use of a VR camera ??

The 2231 has a varifocal lens that be set to any focal point between 2.7mm-13.5mm. Dahua’s fixed lens cameras typically are only 2.8mm, 3.6mm or 6mm.

Like @essjay mentioned, if you need a focal length greater than 6mm (which isn’t uncommon when trying to get a PPF of 100+ to ID people), varifocal is usually your only choice.

Most of my varifocals are zoomed in a good deal past 6mm. If I had to choose a fixed lens camera instead of a varifocal and went with a 6mm, that would mean I’d be stuck with a FOV larger than what I need, which lowers the PPF in the scene, making it harder to ID someone because there will be less detail.

 

[aristobrat]

Which cameras have 4MP 1/1.8 " ?
What do you think of IPC-HDW2231TM-AS-S2, for me there is nothing better for that price

If you go on Dahua’s site and set the location to International, the Pro AI 4MP models should have the 4MP 1/1.8” sensor. I’ll put some links to forum reviews of a few models below in case you haven’t seen them.

Review-OEM 4mp AI Cam IPC-T5442TM-AS Starlight+

Review - OEM IPC-B5442E-ZE 4MP AI Varifocal Bullet Camera With Starlight+

The varifocal HDW2231T-AS-S2 seems like a great camera. It‘s min lux spec is improved over the previous 2231 and current 5231 models (which weren’t shabby to begin with).

 

[Which Cam/NVR?]

Which cameras have 4MP 1/1.8 " ?
What do you think of IPC-HDW2231TM-AS-S2, for me there is nothing better for that price

Has anyone reviewed the IPC-HDW2231TM-AS-S2, because, on Aliexpress, it looks like there are only two sellers who don't hold these cameras in stock, but would have to get them manufactured, so delivery to UK would be about 6, or, 7 weeks?