US President Signs Bill Into Law Requiring FCC To Ban Further Authorizations of Dahua and Hikvision

[Arjun]

Exclusive to ipcamtalk forum members

I am not worry on this, camera business will go on.
But protect customer's data safe is a big task for us. Maybe later we do some topic here for how to improve the System's data safe.

 

[Arjun]

At least China isn't scared to invest and maintain its infrastructure. It takes forever for that level of approval in the US, US infrastructure has been decaying for decades

China is the factory of the world, this will not change in the later 10-15 years and there is a huge demand for chips. If American companies do not chase this market, European and Asian companies will squeeze American companies out. And American companies can't find an alternative market. The final result is that American companies' revenues are lower, profits are falling, companies invest less in research and development, layoffs, and companies lose. So that is why every country want to protect Taiwan now. China not really will make a war on TW, why ? China earn 500-600 billions USD from USA and buy 180billions USD chips from TW in 2021z And Taiwan use the money to buy weapons and tech from US. Lol

Just go to a public toilet , damn US tech again. US standard, very clean.
Ex-Huawei’s brand Honor now have a very huge new office again, 6 buildings with 40 floors. It’s living again, chips going on supply to them now.

Today talk too much political, time go to do some sport. Anyway , I respect US people’s choice.

 

[austwhite]

I am just reading all this now and basically say screw the politicians. I've just ordered 3 Dahua TiOC and a Dahua NVR2216-i to complement my surveillance, and I am going to enjoy the SMD, IVS and all the other stuff Dahua brings to the table.

 

[NDAA]

I shared a factual matter that is relevant to those who buy and use video surveillance products in the US as I did not see any other posts about the US President signing this so I shared it.

I'm late to the game but thankful for the info especially with this bit of news:
"It is possible to purchase from these suppliers and in less than a year, it could be illegal to utilize this equipment in the USA."
From a purely technical support standpoint I will not be buying camera's from banned/rebranded sources.
I'm surprised and disappointed this site is promoting banned products without any kind of disclaimer.

 

[NDAA]

So let's just create a black market for these devices and the government gets no tax money LOL. Typical government practice. How did prohibition work out for the USA lol.

They might as well ban EVERYTHING not 100% conceptualized, designed, created, fabricated, manufactured, built, and sourced from 100% local products...

All of the other product lines that they haven't banned are just as capable if not worse of spying. Some cameras will not work without internet access.

Who else makes drones other than DJI with the same level of precision?

I guess we all need to get off of our tablets, phones, and laptops right now because the likelihood that EVERY component is USA is slim to none.

It was foolish of the United States to turn over manufacturing of key infrastructure to our sworn enemies. I'm more concerned about the routers than cameras. A long time ago a famous communist said something to the effect of "we will sell the west the rope they hang themselves with".

 

[icpilot]

I'm late to the game but thankful for the info especially with this bit of news:
"It is possible to purchase from these suppliers and in less than a year, it could be illegal to utilize this equipment in the USA."
From a purely technical support standpoint I will not be buying camera's from banned/rebranded sources.
I'm surprised and disappointed this site is promoting banned products without any kind of disclaimer.

Troll much?

 

[fenderman]

I'm late to the game but thankful for the info especially with this bit of news:
"It is possible to purchase from these suppliers and in less than a year, it could be illegal to utilize this equipment in the USA."
From a purely technical support standpoint I will not be buying camera's from banned/rebranded sources.
I'm surprised and disappointed this site is promoting banned products without any kind of disclaimer.

It would never be illegal to utilize already purchased equipment. Why would you spread that misinformation.
The products are NOT banned. I'm surprised and disappointed that a dipshit like you would spread misinformation without reading the facts. This is a political/business move. Other brands not part of this legislation have exactly the same issues as hik and dahua. You are actually worse of with most other china brands because there is little probing of their security holes.

 

[NDAA]

Troll much?

2 : a person who intentionally antagonizes others online by posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments

It seems to me your response fits that definition.
The FCC just banned many of these manufacturers from selling into the US. Should any site be promoting banned products without a disclaimer?
If people choose to buy banned equipment that's their choice but that fact should be disclosed.
This is very relevant info. I'm sorry for you that facts antagonize you.

 

[icpilot]

2 : a person who intentionally antagonizes others online by posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments

It seems to me your response fits that definition.
The FCC just banned many of these manufacturers from selling into the US. Should any site be promoting banned products without a disclaimer?
If people choose to buy banned equipment that's their choice but that fact should be disclosed.
This is very relevant info. I'm sorry for you that facts antagonize you.

Either you did not read the legislation that was signed into law, or you didn't understand it. My bet is you haven't a clue and are here merely to create inflammatory posts with your bullshit.

Cheerio ....

 

[fenderman]

2 : a person who intentionally antagonizes others online by posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments

It seems to me your response fits that definition.
The FCC just banned many of these manufacturers from selling into the US. Should any site be promoting banned products without a disclaimer?
If people choose to buy banned equipment that's their choice but that fact should be disclosed.
This is very relevant info. I'm sorry for you that facts antagonize you.

The FCC has not banned anything. Reading comprehension is not your strong point is it? Why would you lie again. Explain yourself or you will be banned - and I mean both your accounts.

 

[NDAA]

It would never be illegal to utilize already purchased equipment. Why would you spread that misinformation.
The products are NOT banned. I'm surprised and disappointed that a dipshit like you would spread misinformation without reading the facts. This is a political/business move. Other brands not part of this legislation have exactly the same issues as hik and dahua. You are actually worse of with most other china brands because there is little probing of their security holes.

It's troubling to hear other brands have similar issues. I'll definitely be on the lookout thanks for the tip. I hoped buying NDAA approved cameras was a good choice. I understood back doors were discovered in Hik cameras which started all this. Whether we agree with the ban or not it still affects us as consumers.

This is what I'm reading in the news...security info watch dot com among others. Are they wrong?
Congress passes bill banning new FCC equipment authorizations for Hikvision, Dahua and others
Oct. 29, 2021
Secure Equipment Act would enshrine proposed rule introduced by FCC earlier this year into law
Joel Griffin
October 22, 2021 – The U.S. House of Representatives on Wednesday passed a bill that would effectively ban the importation and sale of all new products from Chinese surveillance giants Dahua and Hikvision.

 

[fenderman]

It's troubling to hear other brands have similar issues. I'll definitely be on the lookout thanks for the tip. I hoped buying NDAA approved cameras was a good choice. I understood back doors were discovered in Hik cameras which started all this. Whether we agree with the ban or not it still affects us as consumers.

This is what I'm reading in the news...security info watch dot com among others. Are they wrong?
Congress passes bill banning new FCC equipment authorizations for Hikvision, Dahua and others
Oct. 29, 2021
Secure Equipment Act would enshrine proposed rule introduced by FCC earlier this year into law
Joel Griffin
October 22, 2021 – The U.S. House of Representatives on Wednesday passed a bill that would effectively ban the importation and sale of all new products from Chinese surveillance giants Dahua and Hikvision.

Why is it that you cant be bothered to read the bill before spewing misinformation. The article is sensationalized. Must be run by MSNBC.
If you read the bill (Text - H.R.3919 - 117th Congress (2021-2022): Secure Equipment Act of 2021) you would see that
a) Nothing has been banned and that your statement that it would be illegal to utilize equipment if patently false.
b) The bill requires that within a year the fcc no longer approve devices covered under section 2(a) of the Secure and Trusted Communications
Networks Act of 2019 (47 U.S.C. 1601(a)).
c) With respect to hik/dahua That section is only applicable to "to the extent it is used for the purpose of public safety, security of government facilities, physical security surveillance of critical infrastructure, and other national security purposes, including telecommunications or video surveillance services provided by such entity or using such equipment. " List of Equipment and Services Covered By Section 2 of The Secure Networks Act

 

[fenderman]

If you follow the security advice given on this forum, you can use any camera any brand. There has not been a single hik/dahua security flaw / backdoor that could be exploited unless the user provides the internet with direct access to their camera - a foolish thing to do with any ip device.

 

[icpilot]

It's troubling to hear other brands have similar issues. I'll definitely be on the lookout thanks for the tip. I hoped buying NDAA approved cameras was a good choice. I understood back doors were discovered in Hik cameras which started all this. Whether we agree with the ban or not it still affects us as consumers.

This is what I'm reading in the news...security info watch dot com among others. Are they wrong?
Congress passes bill banning new FCC equipment authorizations for Hikvision, Dahua and others
Oct. 29, 2021
Secure Equipment Act would enshrine proposed rule introduced by FCC earlier this year into law
Joel Griffin
October 22, 2021 – The U.S. House of Representatives on Wednesday passed a bill that would effectively ban the importation and sale of all new products from Chinese surveillance giants Dahua and Hikvision.

Typical troll behavior.

The article you cite published 10/29 was updated on 11/12 with the latest found here -> StackPath.

For those, including trolls, who wish to read the actual legislation, visit this link -> Text - H.R.3919 - 117th Congress (2021-2022): Secure Equipment Act of 2021

The bill requires new rules for FCC approval and authorizations be established. Those new rules must be published within one year.

The bill specifically prohibits application of new rules to any current equipment or to any equipment sold prior to the new rules being finalized.

While correct that the new rules potentially have a deleterious impact on future sales of Dahua and Hikvision, it is also true that the new rules may not impact them negatively.

In any case, there is no "ban" on Dahua or Hikvision equipment. Any claim to that effect is FALSE and misleading.

[Edit to Add]: @fenderman beat me to it ....

 

[wittaj]

Don't worry trollster your NDAA compliant devices will be hacked as well if you give them internet access (as I bet most who buy them will do...)...and that is the whole issue that our government fails to recognize with this legislation.

But a lot can happen in a year. Or nothing at all and it remains status quo...

In any event, cameras previously sold and sold up until any new rule is passed are allowed to be used.

 

[NDAA]

I read the bill and the summary from H.R.3919 - 117th Congress (2021-2022): Secure Equipment Act of 2021:
"This bill requires the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) to establish rules stating that it will no longer review or approve any authorization application for equipment that is on the list of covered communications equipment or services. (Listed communications equipment or services are those that the FCC determines pose an unacceptable risk to national security or the security and safety of U.S. persons.)"

I may be misunderstanding this but it seems to me these companies won't be able to sell into the US market.
I'm just trying to get to the truth and appreciate all the back and forth comments and helpful suggestions.
I want to buy cameras that will be supported long into the future. I've seen many technologies become obsolete due to lack of software updates, patching, support, parts availability, etc.
My concern is if banned these cameras will have limited life. Is that a valid concern?

I do plan to follow your suggestions on securing the local camera network to prevent hacking (hopefully!)

 

[wittaj]

You are misunderstanding and a lot of political posturing will be occurring before any new rule is finalized.

I thinkif anything happens as a result of some future rule, the stuff cannot be used on government property, but homeowner can have at it.

You concern about a limited life of these cameras if banned is unwarranted. Read around this site.

With the cameras isolated from the internet, there is no need for software updates, patching, support, etc. on your end. Most software updates are to patch a vulnerability that was found. So if your cameras do not access the internet, it is a useless software update....

A common theme around here is don't fix what ain't broke. If the unit is working and meets your needs, in many instances an update breaks what you had working and provides you with something you didn't need. A Dahua Z12E that someone updated and then constantly reboots comes to mind, and a certain Dahua PTZ that loses autotracking with an update come to mind, a Hikvision ANPR camera losing half the FPS and loses the ability to read US plates - those are big deals to have happen. Don't do it unless it is fixing a problem you are experiencing or adds a feature you really need.

Most of us are running older firmware on our cameras - why - because the camera is working for our needs and are isolated from the internet. Some of my camera firmware goes back to 2018. Camera still meets my needs and provides excellent captures, so why update the firmware and potentially screw it up...

These cameras are like most tech - if it breaks you pitch and buy new and not buy a part to fix it. Even now, it isn't like you can find replacement parts for a Hik or Dahua camera...

You will not find a camera that meets all your needs, so just go build your own cameras with your son and be done with it LOL (we have a good idea who you are....)

 

[icpilot]

I read the bill and the summary from H.R.3919 - 117th Congress (2021-2022): Secure Equipment Act of 2021:
"This bill requires the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) to establish rules stating that it will no longer review or approve any authorization application for equipment that is on the list of covered communications equipment or services. (Listed communications equipment or services are those that the FCC determines pose an unacceptable risk to national security or the security and safety of U.S. persons.)"

I may be misunderstanding this but it seems to me these companies won't be able to sell into the US market.
I'm just trying to get to the truth and appreciate all the back and forth comments and helpful suggestions.
I want to buy cameras that will be supported long into the future. I've seen many technologies become obsolete due to lack of software updates, patching, support, parts availability, etc.
My concern is if banned these cameras will have limited life. Is that a valid concern?

I do plan to follow your suggestions on securing the local camera network to prevent hacking (hopefully!)

Wait! So you are no longer claiming there is a ban of Dahua and Hikvision, correct?

You are no longer accusing this site of promoting the purchase of banned equipment to unsuspecting Americans, correct?

Your sole concern NOW is whether a potential FUTURE ban might render the equipment purchased now and for the next year, to be obsolete sometime thereafter due to diminished vendor support or repair parts being unavailable, is that also correct?

 

[NDAA]

You are misunderstanding and a lot of political posturing will be occurring before any new rule is finalized.

I thinkif anything happens as a result of some future rule, the stuff cannot be used on government property, but homeowner can have at it.

You concern about a limited life of these cameras if banned is unwarranted. Read around this site.

With the cameras isolated from the internet, there is no need for software updates, patching, support, etc. on your end. Most software updates are to patch a vulnerability that was found. So if your cameras do not access the internet, it is a useless software update....

A common theme around here is don't fix what ain't broke. If the unit is working and meets your needs, in many instances an update breaks what you had working and provides you with something you didn't need. A Dahua Z12E that someone updated and then constantly reboots comes to mind, and a certain Dahua PTZ that loses autotracking with an update come to mind, a Hikvision ANPR camera losing half the FPS and loses the ability to read US plates - those are big deals to have happen. Don't do it unless it is fixing a problem you are experiencing or adds a feature you really need.

Most of us are running older firmware on our cameras - why - because the camera is working for our needs and are isolated from the internet. Some of my camera firmware goes back to 2018. Camera still meets my needs and provides excellent captures, so why update the firmware and potentially screw it up...

These cameras are like most tech - if it breaks you pitch and buy new and not buy a part to fix it. Even now, it isn't like you can find replacement parts for a Hik or Dahua camera...

You will not find a camera that meets all your needs, so just go build your own cameras with your son and be done with it LOL (we have a good idea who you are....)

Thanks that was helpful.

 

[fenderman]

I read the bill and the summary from H.R.3919 - 117th Congress (2021-2022): Secure Equipment Act of 2021:
"This bill requires the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) to establish rules stating that it will no longer review or approve any authorization application for equipment that is on the list of covered communications equipment or services. (Listed communications equipment or services are those that the FCC determines pose an unacceptable risk to national security or the security and safety of U.S. persons.)"

I may be misunderstanding this but it seems to me these companies won't be able to sell into the US market.
I'm just trying to get to the truth and appreciate all the back and forth comments and helpful suggestions.
I want to buy cameras that will be supported long into the future. I've seen many technologies become obsolete due to lack of software updates, patching, support, parts availability, etc.
My concern is if banned these cameras will have limited life. Is that a valid concern?

I do plan to follow your suggestions on securing the local camera network to prevent hacking (hopefully!)

Why would a camera become obsolete simply because there is no firmware update? If the camera is running fine there is no reason for an update. You think large international companies cant survive outside the US? What parts do you need? These cameras are not user serviceable anyway. I have never purchased a camera "part". The camera will become obsolete in its own when in 3 years a camera twice as good is available for the same price. You dont get any direct support from hik or dahua anywhen when purchasing from anyone other than an authorized vendor.