Feedback on Potential Blue Iris Server

[TL1096r]

@Judman thank you for the link to the G4 HP manual and writing that you use two drives for video storage. Thanks to the manual you linked, I am confident that G4 would allow a 2.5" SSD plus two 3.5" HDDs and an optical drive as well which I think I would also like to have. It does not sound like I will be getting a 12TB purple drive any time soon

@TL1096r Thank you for creating and maintaining the Newbie Guide. Clearly I need it. I have read it and will be rereading it. That is how I new to even ask about a separate drive for video storage, though I do not see in that guide what @Judman explained about the benefit of using two drives for video storage (though I know I have previously read that somewhere else here at ipcamtalk), so I am still glad I asked. I know hard drives are covered somewhat in the Wiki, but reading similar things different ways certainly helps me understand (eventually...hopefully).
It sounds like I am starting my build from the opposite direction you did. I am not certain my approach will prove better, but I know that getting to 10+ cameras as I intend will be expensive and I would like to get a few running in the next month or so. I can definitely be going ahead and running cables (as soon as I acquire some cable) but I think I should be computer hunting now too.

I like the SFF for the compactness if it will still meet my needs, which I currently think is one SSD, two high capacity HDDs (WD purple if I can afford), a second NIC, and potentially an optical drive. It does not appear likely I will need to have a dedicated graphics card. I want as much CPU as I can get for around $400ish and I would like to end up with at least 16 GB of RAM, though I see that the Wiki says I will be find starting at 8 GB. It sounds like the G4 will do all of that. If anyone sees something I am over looking, please point that out to me.

I will lean on the Newbie Guide to research potential cameras for my setup, though I will not be surprised if I end up asking dumb questions about those too


Thank you all again, I appreciate your continuing help.

Yes, everyone must go at their own pace and what is comfortable for them. The hp g4 sff gives you everything you want: 2hdd a nvme or ssd. I like having that much power in a smaller machine.

But to avoid confusion I am simply saying that if a computer is holding up your build it should not. I would purchase all cams, switch and wiring. By the time I had the right computer everything was set up. All I had to do was plug in the switch to the second NIC and load the BI file into the new BI machine and I was ready to go.

 

[mincient]

@Judman Your logic on saving cameras covering similar areas on different drives sounds like a good idea to me.
I have a an good (though small 256 GB) SSD laying around, is why I plan to use an SSD for Windows and BI. Of course depending on what computer I end up getting, it may come with one or I may end up going NVMe.
Thank you for sharing how long storage is lasting with your setup.
Good to know on the RAM.
Is this i5-8400 HP Pavilion 590-P0066 similar to what you are using?

@TL1096r I appreciate your encouragement to move forward with my build dedicated computer or not.

I am certain I will get lost in trying to pick out cameras... Besides trying to spread out the expense of acquiring all the cameras I will want, another thought I have is that it might be good to have one to evaluate, perhaps on a test rig like @SouthernYankee's, before I commit to any make or model. Is there any validity to that approach?

Regardless, there is plenty of networking work I can be doing right now.

Also, is there any benefit to Windows 10 Pro over Home as far using for a BI server goes?

Thanks

 

[Judman]

@mincient That is the exact model and specs. I have a 256gb Patriot Scorch M.2 drive in there. It works like a dream.

 

[TL1096r]

Go with windows 10 pro. It has RDP. There is no reason to go with home.

i am a fan of the sabrent NVMe:

Robot Check

Test rig can help.

This site can guide you:

IPVM Designer / Calculator

Using Google Maps, layout and design cameras, choosing from 10,000+ models, delivering FoV and image quality previews plus export to PDF, Powerpoint and more

calculator.ipvm.com

 

[mincient]

@Judman cool, thank you for confirming that is your machine. I am going to try to find something that will let me run a 2.5" and two 3.5", but I will keep that Pavillion in mind.

@TL1096r Ok, that helps, I did not realize Windows 10 Home does not have RPD. I am going to try to avoid the NVMe money for now.


There is a $500 G4 i7-8700 on eBay right now, that looks like a decent deal, am I missing anything in that listing or should I get that one?

 

[fenderman]

@Judman cool, thank you for confirming that is your machine. I am going to try to find something that will let me run a 2.5" and two 3.5", but I will keep that Pavillion in mind.

@TL1096r Ok, that helps, I did not realize Windows 10 Pro does not have RPD. I am going to try to avoid the NVMe money for now.


There is a $500 G4 i7-8700 on eBay right now, that looks like a decent deal, am I missing anything in that listing or should I get that one?

That is a very good deal. Pop an ssd in there and its gold. You should be able to get it at a lower price by making an offer.

 

[Walrus]

Yeah considering an i7-8700 CPU alone is $300+

 

[windguy]

There is a $500 G4 i7-8700 on eBay right now, that looks like a decent deal, am I missing anything in that listing or should I get that one?

I thought it was a decent price as well since I too am trying to find a BI server.
That seller "blueworxoutlet" listed about five Elitedesks for sale on Friday. Nice looking machines.
I contacted them with a basic question, which they quickly answered, but then said "however you only have a feedback score of two so we can not sell to you."
WTF! That was a shocker. So because I don't buy a bunch of stuff on Fleabay this seller is penalizing me. Their retort was "It is pretty common practice. Thanks anyway"
I've asked a few other sellers similar questions any no one has given me the same message. Hope it's an isolated case because I do want to buy a used Elitedesk. I'll keep searching.
Good luck in yours.

 

[fenderman]

I thought it was a decent price as well since I too am trying to find a BI server.
That seller "blueworxoutlet" listed about five Elitedesks for sale on Friday. Nice looking machines.
I contacted them with a basic question, which they quickly answered, but then said "however you only have a feedback score of two so we can not sell to you."
WTF! That was a shocker. So because I don't buy a bunch of stuff on Fleabay this seller is penalizing me. Their retort was "It is pretty common practice. Thanks anyway"
I've asked a few other sellers similar questions any no one has given me the same message. Hope it's an isolated case because I do want to buy a used Elitedesk. I'll keep searching.
Good luck in yours.

This is normal, they dont want to get screwed over. Lots of buyers scamming sellers on ebay. Ask them if they will sell it direct without ebay. You can buy a few 1 dollar items to get your feedback up.

 

[windguy]

This is normal, they dont want to get screwed over. Lots of buyers scamming sellers on ebay. Ask them if they will sell it direct without ebay. You can buy a few 1 dollar items to get your feedback up.

Thanks Fenderman. Good suggestions - will give them a try.

 

[mincient]

@fenderman, @Walrus, and @windguy
Thank you for the quick feedback. With that pricing being under others currently on eBay, I wanted to ensure I am not missing something. Still above my planned budget (sort of how these things often go), so I made an offer, though the seller does not appear willing to come down much, so I will see.

@windguy I experienced that "your feedback is low, so I will not sell to you" forever ago though I had forgotten about it until you mentioned it. Hopefully you do not have that with every seller, but I expect blueworxoutlet is not the only one who still does it. Like @fenderman wrote, if you continue to get it, you may need to sell or buy a few cheap things on FleaBay to build up a little feedback....but hopefully not.

 

[TL1096r]

@Judman cool, thank you for confirming that is your machine. I am going to try to find something that will let me run a 2.5" and two 3.5", but I will keep that Pavillion in mind.

@TL1096r Ok, that helps, I did not realize Windows 10 Pro does not have RPD. I am going to try to avoid the NVMe money for now.


There is a $500 G4 i7-8700 on eBay right now, that looks like a decent deal, am I missing anything in that listing or should I get that one?

PRO has RPD.

Yes that is a good deal. That eBay seller is reputable and always has good deals. That computer gives you a lot of room to expand.

You might show them this thread and tell them you have a confirmed paypal address and have no intention to scam them? I am not sure if it will work but I ordered from them before and their product was like-brand new at a great price and fast shipping.

 

[mincient]

@TL1096r thank you for pointing out my typo. I meant to type that I did not realize Home does not have RDP as you had just informed me of that. I edited my incorrect post above so that if someone reads it in the future, I do not misinform them...
Thank you also for sharing your experience with blueworxoutlet on eBay, that gives me more confidence to go with them (if I get a response to the questions I sent them this morning).

 

[looney2ns]

@mincient No worries! I went through this same process about a year ago getting a system off the ground for myself. I don't know that it is mentioned in the newb guide, but I have 2 cameras (one from each side of the house) saving footage to purple drive 1 and 2 cameras (again one from each side of the house) saving to purple drive 2. This is relatively easy to do in BlueIris with the recording setting and Aux configs. I don't know that this is the right or best way to do thing's but its been working for me. The logic I had was that if a drive fails, I still have half my clips and hopefully footage in the event I need it.

I also have the boot drive as a nvme ssd because my HP motherboard only have two sata drive connections, so that forced my hand on the SSD, but I don't think its necessary on a dedicated BI PC since you aren't booting often or loading applications a lot. Im sure there are some performance benefits with the database though so it cant hurt.

I will add that I have 4 (3 at 10 fps, 1 at 15 fps and all at VBR-Best 2048kpbs) cameras running on H.265 and get about 4 months of storage across the two 3 TB purple drives in my system.

16 GB is nice, but I really dont think it will be necessary on a BI PC so dont let 8 or 12 GB sway you from a good base PC that you can throw 40-60$ at later to add a ram stick.

As for camera's, there are so many reviews and topics about the main consumer cameras on this forum that you should be set when it comes time to pick those out!

I recently found a deal on 8gb of ram for my Dell Optiplex i7700. It originally only had 8gb.
After I added the additional 8, CPU usage dropped by around 8%, and the GPU went from 20% to 25% useage down to 8-10%.
Power draw on the computer dropped 12 watts.
It was worth the $35 I spent for the Crucial stick.

 

[Judman]

I recently found a deal on 8gb of ram for my Dell Optiplex i7700. It originally only had 8gb.
After I added the additional 8, CPU usage dropped by around 8%, and the GPU went from 20% to 25% useage down to 8-10%.
Power draw on the computer dropped 12 watts.
It was worth the $35 I spent for the Crucial stick.

Wow that is quite drastic! Was the original 8 GB completely utilized before?

Color me surprised that is makes that much of a difference.

 

[windguy]

I recently found a deal on 8gb of ram for my Dell Optiplex i7700. It originally only had 8gb.
After I added the additional 8, CPU usage dropped by around 8%, and the GPU went from 20% to 25% useage down to 8-10%.
Power draw on the computer dropped 12 watts.
It was worth the $35 I spent for the Crucial stick.

That's very cool. Nice upgrade at a minimal cost.
Now you can update your signature to show your NVR Optiplex has 16GB

 

[mincient]

Ok...I got distracted, but hopefully I will actually order soon. Since I plan to go to 16GB of RAM anyway, the same seller now has a couple of 16 GB machines for $30 more.
For the same price either way ($530) would I be better off to get the 1 TB harddrive and a RX550, or a 2 TB harddrive and no RX550?

With either machine, I will be installing a 256 GB SSD for Windows and Blue Iris.

Thank you

 

[Judman]

The RX550 won't do you any good since you are most likely going to use intel quicksync. Ask for no HDD or graphics card and more of a discount lol