Need advice on new budget system purchase

[clean]

Hey guys,


I currently have my house wired with cat5 to four camera locations. the current system im running is one of those el-cheapo china 1080P all in one box junk setups.

the detail in fullscreen mode ( 4 channel simultaneous view scales down) is actully pretty good, but everything else about it is horrible. no motion detection accuracy, screen always flickering - basically useless.

Anyway, I want a basic plug n play dahua or hikvision ( or similar) 4 camera setup with the main focus on # 1 reliable/accurate motion detection or tripwire etc, and number two easy/reliable connectivity to my smartphone.

I hear a lot about people getting there nvr hacked? can this happen to standard run of the mill hikvision/dahua nvr's?

I am subscribed to a software based VPN, dont know if i can use that?

basically I just want a 4 camera setup to plug into my existing cat5 cables that is easy/reliable, and easy on the budget. I dont need cutting edge starlight 200$ per camera type stuff - just decent and reliable - that is all.

thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[clean]

after reading reviews on the android play store it seems people are the happiest with the HIKVISION app vs dahua or other apps. does HIKVISION have the best smartphone access?

 

[aristobrat]

A year or so ago, it looked like Hikvision and Dahua used the same 3rd-party developer for there apps, at least for iOS. They looked/functioned almost the same.

If you want reliable motion detection then you either need to run Blue Iris on a PC for your NVR, or get a Hikvision/Dahua camera model that supports smarter motion detection. Hik calls theirs Smart Events and Dahua calls theirs IVS.

These cameras outside? Unless you have abnormally bright lights on constantly throughout the night, the Dahua Starlight or Hikvision DarkFighters are going to give you low-light recordings with the least amount of blur. They both have models that start in the $120 range. When you start finding models a lot cheaper than that, you’ve got to make sure you’re not buying models made only for use in China. They usually come with a hacked firmware (that adds multiple languages) that can’t ever be upgraded. The item description usually mentions the firmware can’t be upgraded, but didn’t mention why.

Your VPN subscription is backwards from what you need. It protects outgoing Internet traffic from your house. You need a VPN that securely allows Internet traffic into your house.

Alternatively, both Hikvision and Dahua offer a P2P feature on their cameras and NVRs that will allow you (while you’re outside of your house) to connect back in without having to port-forward or use a VPN. Since their servers are involved to initiate the connection each time, it’s still not thought as safe as if you have your own private VPN setup, but IMO it’s significantly more safe than port forwarding. People still occasionally start threads here about coming home and finding their canera system reset, and it’s almost always because they had port forwarding setup to devices running old vulnerable firmware versions. IIRC, both Hikvision and Dahua have had firmware issues in the past that were bad.

 

[clean]

A year or so ago, it looked like Hikvision and Dahua used the same 3rd-party developer for there apps, at least for iOS. They looked/functioned almost the same.

If you want reliable motion detection then you either need to run Blue Iris on a PC for your NVR, or get a Hikvision/Dahua camera model that supports smarter motion detection. Hik calls theirs Smart Events and Dahua calls theirs IVS.

These cameras outside? Unless you have abnormally bright lights on constantly throughout the night, the Dahua Starlight or Hikvision DarkFighters are going to give you low-light recordings with the least amount of blur. They both have models that start in the $120 range.

Your VPN subscription is backwards from what you need. It protects outgoing Internet traffic from your house. You need a VPN that securely allows Internet traffic into your house. Both Hikvision and Dahua offer a P2P feature that will allow you (while you’re outside of your house) to connect back in without having to port-forward. Since their servers are involved to initiate the connection each time, it’s still not thought as safe as if you have your own private VPN setup, but IMO it’s significantly more safe than port forwarding. People still occasionally start threads here about coming home and finding their canera system reset, and it’s almost always because they had port forwarding setup to devices running old vulnerable firmware versions.

Thanks for the reply.

the Hikvision and Dahua P2P feature would be fine for me.

running blue iris on a dedicated pc really isn't an option as I have limited space for another pc.

fortunately the front of my house is lit really well by LED street lights ( also 2.8mm or similar would be fine for the front) , however the back is quite dark, and optimally I would want a longer focal range ( 8-12mm) as the suspect area is about 60 ft away.

would buying off ebay or amazon be my best bet? i know the cams are Chinese and unable to update but for my purposes that would be fine.

or would i need to buy from someone like andy to have a NVR that had the P2P feature? paying a little more for a system that will work properly is of course fine with me.

 

[mat200]

Thanks for the reply.

the Hikvision and Dahua P2P feature would be fine for me.

running blue iris on a dedicated pc really isn't an option as I have limited space for another pc.

fortunately the front of my house is lit really well by LED street lights ( also 2.8mm or similar would be fine for the front) , however the back is quite dark, and optimally I would want a longer focal range ( 8-12mm) as the suspect area is about 60 ft away.

would buying off ebay or amazon be my best bet? i know the cams are Chinese and unable to update but for my purposes that would be fine.

or would i need to buy from someone like andy to have a NVR that had the P2P feature? paying a little more for a system that will work properly is of course fine with me.

Hi @clean

I would highly recommend keeping the cameras isolated if you decide to go with IP cameras which can not be updated and avoid any P2P, UPnP, port forwarding.

 

[looney2ns]

Thanks for the reply.

the Hikvision and Dahua P2P feature would be fine for me.

running blue iris on a dedicated pc really isn't an option as I have limited space for another pc.

fortunately the front of my house is lit really well by LED street lights ( also 2.8mm or similar would be fine for the front) , however the back is quite dark, and optimally I would want a longer focal range ( 8-12mm) as the suspect area is about 60 ft away.

would buying off ebay or amazon be my best bet? i know the cams are Chinese and unable to update but for my purposes that would be fine.

or would i need to buy from someone like andy to have a NVR that had the P2P feature? paying a little more for a system that will work properly is of course fine with me.

Study this: cliff notes
A Dell Optiplex SFF pc is about the same size as many NVR's. And quieter than many NVRs.
The only correct way to remote view cams is via a VPN, which the BI app excels at. VPN Primer for Noobs
2.8mm lens almost useless outdoors, To id anyone, they would need to be as near as 10ft from the cameras.
This cam is hard to beat on a budget.
Review-Dahua IPC-HDW2231RP-ZS Starlight Camera-Varifocal

 

[clean]

@looney2ns

Study this: cliff notes
A Dell Optiplex SFF pc is about the same size as many NVR's. And quieter than many NVRs.
The only correct way to remote view cams is via a VPN, which the BI app excels at. VPN Primer for Noobs
2.8mm lens almost useless outdoors, To id anyone, they would need to be as near as 10ft from the cameras.
This cam is hard to beat on a budget.
Review-Dahua IPC-HDW2231RP-ZS Starlight Camera-Varifocal

Thanks for the info.

ive got a deal going with andy for 4x HDW2231RP-ZS and a dauha NVR4104-P-4KS2 4 channel NVR with POE.

is it possible to use that nvr with a VPN? I could go the dedicated blue iris PC route for probably the same money but I have no idea how to connect the cameras to the PC . cameras to poe injector....poe injector to pc via USB?

then I also need to buy POE injector..... seems more complicated then the all in one dahua NVR?

any additional advice greatly appreciated. thanks.

 

[fenderman]

@looney2ns



Thanks for the info.

ive got a deal going with andy for 4x HDW2231RP-ZS and a dauha NVR4104-P-4KS2 4 channel NVR with POE.

is it possible to use that nvr with a VPN? I could go the dedicated blue iris PC route for probably the same money but I have no idea how to connect the cameras to the PC . cameras to poe injector....poe injector to pc via USB?

then I also need to buy POE injector..... seems more complicated then the all in one dahua NVR?

any additional advice greatly appreciated. thanks.

Go with the NVR. I suggest that everyone start with an NVR that way when they realize what it can't do and they want to throw it against the wall they will appreciate Blue Iris more.

 

[clean]

@fenderman

ha, thanks for that.

ok im just going to buy the cams and get a dedicated PC.

Besides the PC can someone advise me on what hardware to buy in terms of what I will need to power the cameras ( reliable, but budget please)and anything else I might need?

I will learn as I go when setting this stuff up.

TIA.

 

[J Sigmo]

You're on the right forum to help you with your questions. I'm extremely happy with Blue Iris on a dedicated PC. The flexibility and customizability is fantastic. Motion detection settings are also superior to anything else I've seen.

Get a good quality POE+ switch with two to four times as many channels as you think you want right now. And run at least two ethernet cables to each place you think needs just one. You can then add cameras as you realize you need more.

Lots of locations need a wide overview as well as a tighter view at part of the scene so you can identify people.

 

[VorlonFrog]

@fenderman

ha, thanks for that.

ok im just going to buy the cams and get a dedicated PC.

Besides the PC can someone advise me on what hardware to buy in terms of what I will need to power the cameras ( reliable, but budget please)and anything else I might need?

I will learn as I go when setting this stuff up.

TIA.

re: budget PC for Blue Iris - search eBay for 'Dell Optiplex SFF 9020 Core i7' and see what turns up.

 

[clean]

Thanks guys,

If all the cat5 from the cameras connects to the Poe switch, typically how does the Poe switch connect to the PC to send the video feeds to the computer/blue Iris?

Just one USB connection?

 

[mat200]

Thanks guys,

If all the cat5 from the cameras connects to the Poe switch, typically how does the Poe switch connect to the PC to send the video feeds to the computer/blue Iris?

Just one USB connection?

Ethernet cat5e/6 to the network port ( RJ45 )

 

[Walrus]

No, you connect another ethernet cable from the switch to the PC.

Edit: mat200 beat me to it.

 

[clean]

So obviously the Dell Optiplex SFF type computers would need to have two RJ45 inputs as that would be pretty important. One for internet and one for camera feed.

 

[Walrus]

If it doesn't, you can add a 2nd NIC in a pci/pcie slot if available.

The other way is by connecting the POE switch to your router, the BI PC to your router, and then in the router interface block the cameras from accessing the internet.

 

[looney2ns]

If it doesn't, you can add a 2nd NIC in a pci/pcie slot if available.

The other way is by connecting the POE switch to your router, the BI PC to your router, and then in the router interface block the cameras from accessing the internet.

Incorrect, you want to:

• Connect all cameras to a POE switch
• Connect the BI PC to the same POE switch as the cameras
• Connect the same POE switch to the router
• This prevents all that traffic from passing through the router, as some routers will choke on it.

How to Secure Your Network (Don't Get Hacked!) | IP Cam Talk
Choosing Hardware for Blue Iris | IP Cam Talk
Blue Iris Video Tutorials
Study this: Cliff Notes

Not everyone needs to use two network cards, if the rest of the network is setup correctly.

 

[looney2ns]

Thanks guys,

If all the cat5 from the cameras connects to the Poe switch, typically how does the Poe switch connect to the PC to send the video feeds to the computer/blue Iris?

Just one USB connection?

USB is not used.
POE switch example: https://www.amazon.com/IPCamPower-Network-Additional-Designed-Cameras/dp/B07BVVWYHN/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1548700272&sr=8-4&keywords=ipcampower+poe+switch

 

[Walrus]

Incorrect, you want to:

• Connect all cameras to a POE switch
• Connect the BI PC to the same POE switch as the cameras
• Connect the same POE switch to the router
• This prevents all that traffic from passing through the router, as some routers will choke on it.

Ah right, didn't think about the network traffic.

 

[clean]

would this switch work? would it have enough power for 4x IPC-HDW2231R-ZS ??

https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B076HZFY3F/ref=asc_df_B076HZFY3F1548673200000/?tag=shopbotca-20&creative=395285&creativeASIN=B076HZFY3F&linkCode=df0