Are camera's useful anymore for theft?

notta

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I live in a relatively good neighborhood but because of the location (out of the way) we have a lot of issues with people's cars being broken into and even stolen. 2 cars in the past year, that I know of, have been stolen from my neighborhood.

This morning I received a message to check my camera's to see if anyone was on it around 1-3 am. Sure enough around 2:15 am a guy walks up to my car and tried to open the driver side door and then moved to the next house. His face was fully covered with a mask and had gloves on. Even if my camera's did capture anything it would have been useless. There were also 3 of them. 2 across the street. If I was awake and I went out there I would probably have 3 people jumping on me and that is if you don't get shot first.

I am more worried about it escalating and getting into the houses. For the first time in my life I am actually considering a gun. I have never even held a gun but this is what it's coming to.

I have Hikvision camera's that are good but pretty useless at night to really identify anything. They are supposed to be motion activated but things such as bugs and headlights are constantly causing motion trips. Do they make perimeter alert systems? Maybe some invisible barrier so if someone breaks the barrier in the middle of the night I can get alerted. Would seem there would be less of a chance of false alarms, except for maybe critters and such, than motion activation on the camera's.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks.
 
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fenderman

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I live in a relatively good neighborhood but because of the location (out of the way) we have a lot of issues with people's cars being broken into and even stolen. 2 cars in the past year, that I know of, have been stolen from my neighborhood.

This morning I received a message to check my camera's to see if anyone was on it around 1-3 am. Sure enough around 2:15 am a guy walks up to my car and tried to open the driver side door and then moved to the next house. His face was fully covered with a mask and had gloves on. Even if my camera's did capture anything useful it would have been useless. There were also 3 of them. 2 across the street. If I was awake and I went out there I would probably have 3 people jumping on me and that is if you don't get shot first.

I am more worried about it escalating and getting into the houses. For the first time in my life I am actually considering a gun. I have never even held a gun but this is what it's coming to.

I have Hikvision camera's that are good but pretty useless at night to really identify anything. They are supposed to be motion activated but things such as bugs and headlights are constantly causing motion trips. Do they make perimeter alert systems? Maybe some invisible barrier so if someone breaks the barrier in the middle of the night I can get alerted. Would seem there would be less of a chance of false alarms, except for maybe critters and such, than motion activation on the camera's.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks.
No, remove the cameras. They are pointless as you noted. Waste of electricity.
 

K175un3

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notta, you could consider using constant recording at night time.
 

DRZmaui

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Consider LPR (license plate reader) cameras in addition to reg cameras. Sure the individuals were caseing the neighborhood prior
 

K175un3

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That's another reason for constantly recording footage, motion detection may not get all the footage you need.
 

dryfly

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I am more worried about it escalating and getting into the houses. For the first time in my life I am actually considering a gun. I have never even held a gun but this is what it's coming to.
To me, cameras are an essential addition to a secure house, but are not designed to "protect" you. Firearms are!

If you have zero experience with guns please carefully consider before you buy. Get training. In your case, lots of training. And remember, owning and shooting a firearm is completely different than using one in a self defense situation.

Sorry for the digression, I know this is a CCTV forum.
 

K175un3

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Get a compound crossbow or bow instead if you're considering home and personal defence, they make less noise and with practice or experience of course can be non lethal (crippling).

And how many folks will walk into a Hospital with a Bolt or Arrow injury? It can make things a lot easier to sort out.
 

notta

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That was why I asked my original question. Security camera's have their purposes for many things but what good are they when thieves are fully aware of them now and are concealing themselves? In that case a camera will show what they were doing but will be useless in identifying someone. Also my camera's are recording 24/7 but at least it shows me in the interface when an event occurs. The only issue is that so many things can cause a motion event. My neighbor farted last week and it generated an event. With all seriousness having the footage now is useless because they are now covering up.

Consider LPR (license plate reader) cameras in addition to reg cameras. Sure the individuals were caseing the neighborhood prior
Believe me I have looked into it. My house should be a good spot for it as well because I live on the main road to my neighborhood. It's the only road in or out of my neighborhood cars pass my house coming in and going out. The question I have is whether the LPR will work because of the distance. It's daytime but I recall when I measured in the past that the center of the road to the front of my house is 65'. My 2 camera's out front are in the second story soffit which is assume would be approximately 16' from the ground. I know you can use some trig for this but the question is what would be the needed distance to capture a license plate on the green angle. I could also put it on the opposite angle of the house. We live in a state with license plates only in the back so going out is when you would capture them. How does speed affect that as well? By the time the camera takes the pic the car may be out of distance. Also this stuff only occurs at night so night vision quality is an issue as well. I don't have any answers to these questions.

We use to have a (orange box) MPH camera, yea in front of my house, to alert people they were speeding in the neighborhood. That has since been removed. I was thinking about bringing up to the Civic Association but this would probably fall on my lap so I would need to make sure my network is up at all times. I really don't want that kind of responsibility.

I don't have a problem paying the money for the camera myself but I'm not buying it and doing all the work to only find out it doesn't work because of the distance. I called up one of the places that sells them but they were not very helpful.

Oh, one more thing. This is all null and void if they park in the front of the neighborhood, which I am near the front, or walk into it.

Taken with my phone as my NVR is isolated.
house_dims.png
 
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crw030

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I feel like something mounted near that bush would give you a dramatically better LPR angle, possibly look at direct-burial of a cable with some post or something to mount the camera's to. You could bury it next to your sidewalk & driveway to minimize impact to your yard?
 

notta

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I feel like something mounted near that bush would give you a dramatically better LPR angle, possibly look at direct-burial of a cable with some post or something to mount the camera's to. You could bury it next to your sidewalk & driveway to minimize impact to your yard?
That is not a bad idea! My only concern, would you be comfortable placing an $800 camera somewhere fully accessible like that? I did think about building a custom mailbox out of brick or something and having one side of it for the mail and the other for a camera that would be hidden that could be secured but that is a fair amount of work. My mailbox is right in front of the tree and would be a perfect spot.
 

bigredfish

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Good advise with the above comments.

-I would (and did) buy the gun and get trained with it Wayyyyyy before I bothered with cameras.
-LE cares about two things really, Facial ID and License plate numbers.
- Those angles suck. You want to be less than 30 degrees.
- LPR capable cameras can be had for between $200-$300 , many of us use them
 

K175un3

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Razor wire to discourage access and cover it with another cam notta, also I'm sure that there's cheaper LPR capable cams available that'll provide excellent results.

Not too sure about this, but it may be an option.

The CMOS seems the same used in the LPR cams, so if it is possible it could be used you would need to use angles of 30° or less for capture and a high shutter speed.
 

looney2ns

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Couple of things:
  • Most cars are stolen or "broken into" simply because they were not locked and or the keys where left in them.
  • A lot of homes are "broken into" because they didn't lock the doors, or close a window or they left the garage door open all night.
  • Your cameras are mounted to high, you don't have a chance at ID'ing anyone with a cam mounted more than 8ft high.
  • Your angle to the road is too sharp for LPR
  • The distance for LPR is workable, just not with the cameras you have.
  • Study this area of this forum closely: LPR | IP Cam Talk
  • Study these closely wiki and the cliff notes.
  • First order of business is to install a good monitored alarm system if you have breakin concerns.
  • A gun is fine, but it's not as simple as just buying one.
  • It's a huge responsibility.
  • You MUST have proper training and practice practice practice. Buying a guitar does not make you a musician.
  • You must know your local and state laws concerning guns.
  • Don't go out and confront someone who is doing property crimes, call the popo and be a good witness.
  • The NRA has several good classes, find a certified instructor in your area to walk you through all this.
  • They are reasons there is 100's of models of weapons, not every gun works for everyone.
  • On you tube, find the channel Active Self Protection and watch Johns many videos.
  • Security cams are absolutely still relevant when the system is properly designed and installed.
 

crw030

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I did think about building a custom mailbox out of brick or something
That's a better plan but more a long-term solution I'm guessing. As mentioned by @bigredfish even two cameras at that much improved angle won't cost nearly $800. Mounted near the bush or in a custom mailbox config I doubt 99.9999999% of passerby's would even see it. I have a giant white circle, dead center above my garage door, and the garage is painted puke green. Everyone still acts surprised and asks where the camera is located, including a guest staying in the guest bedroom for past 4 months.
 

looney2ns

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When people stand at my front door, they are within arms reach of a turret camera. 80% of them never realize there is a camera there. It's not hidden nor disguised in any way.
 

K175un3

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Ahem crw030, you forgot to mention me in that post.

bigredfish just gave the final nod on the Dahua IPC-HFW5241E-Z12E, as from all reports it's a good cam at a reasonable price range. And more importantly they use them, as nothing beats experience.
 

looney2ns

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mat200

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I live in a relatively good neighborhood but because of the location (out of the way) we have a lot of issues with people's cars being broken into and even stolen. 2 cars in the past year, that I know of, have been stolen from my neighborhood.

This morning I received a message to check my camera's to see if anyone was on it around 1-3 am. Sure enough around 2:15 am a guy walks up to my car and tried to open the driver side door and then moved to the next house. His face was fully covered with a mask and had gloves on....
HI @notta

and to contrast that, there are thieves who are walking around in the middle of the day with exposed tattoos...
Plan for more than 2 cameras... package thieves

and
"4K" cameras captures package thieves in board daylight. Can you easily ID the perps?


also remember, there is other information which the thief may not realize they are exposing and when combined with an alarm system and the ability to get a proper police response that information may help to capture that person. ( color of clothing, image of car, approx build of suspect,.. )
 

K175un3

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Folks are also forgetting that good footage can also be used to analyse the way a person of interest moves including any physical idiosyncrasies that they have, as no two people move the same way and this can be used to identify individuals.
 
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