I want the best Dahua

Discussion in 'Dahua' started by RichardPryor, Feb 11, 2019.

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  1. RichardPryor

    RichardPryor Young grasshopper

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    @tangent I didn’t mean solid copper vs cca. I meant solid vs stranded.

    Stranded

    Solid

    Driveway might be 200-300ft long. Less from the hill that worries me. Here are a few pictures of the shop, the house and the driveway.

    First one are 2 cameras that I want to keep from the shop. One points towards the driveway the other towards the house.

    [​IMG]

    Second pictures shows a different angle, looking back at the house. Sorry for sun reflection.

    [​IMG]

    Third picture shows the blind spot that I have on that camera pointing towards the driveway. Tree is in the way and angle not ideal.

    [​IMG]

    Fourth and fifth picture show 2 angles right after the hill. One is towards the house and one towards the road. Here’s where I plan on putting the gate.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Last 2 pictures show where I plan on having one camera, right below the deck pointing towards the driveway. I still have a blind spot past the hill so I want a gate and a camera there pointing towards the road.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    And here’s a video of me walking the driveway from the shop.

     
  2. RichardPryor

    RichardPryor Young grasshopper

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    Oh, and are you guys suggesting I run cat-6 inside conduit inside the house (through studs)? Or just where i’ll Bury cable outside/underground @VorlonFrog
     
  3. Ckb3

    Ckb3 Young grasshopper

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    I would use conduit inside for locations that you wouldn't have access to once the home is complete so that if there was a problem, you would be able to replace cable AND always outside or in burial applications. Anything outside i would suggest a minimum of 1" conduit. Also, nice dog!
     
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  4. tangent

    tangent IPCT Contributor

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    On the Cat-6 use solid not stranded. Also use pure copper, not CCA crap. Stranded cable is mostly used for patch cables, which you're better off buying pre-made. Terminate cables to the T-568B standard.
    I'm getting the impression you don't know that much about networking, but you obviously know your way around construction. What sort of experience do you have with networking, cabling, and electrical work?

    I wouldn't use conduit inside the house in most locations. Conduit makes sense in a few places to facilitate future cable runs. Some people like to do things like run conduit from the basement to the attic, but that has to be fire stopped. I would run an empty conduit from places you plan on having a TV to locations where you might want to put equipment like a receiver. I assume the lower level is going to be finished. What type of insulation is being used? Spray foam obviously limits what you can do after construction more than fiberglass and is a reason some people might run more conduit.

    Where do you plan on having all of the cable terminate? Are you planning on using a structured media cabinet or a wall mounted rack? A rack would be my preference. Implementing this important aspect of a cabling project well can be more complicated than it seems.

    Don't neglect coax, ethernet, and alarm wiring in the rest of the house, don't rely on wifi for everything. You can get cable that has multiple coax and ethernet cables bundled together to save time. Sometimes you'll find people selling cable like this on craigslist for a deep discount, but don't buy any single mode fiber that fell off a truck.

    What kind of internet access will you have? I'd run multiple ethernet and coax as well as conduit from your wiring closet to the outside of the house for utilities.

    Has electricity been run to the house yet? It looks like you'll be running power from the shop to the house.

    I'd probably treat a gate as a separate project to be completed later. You might decide you don't even want to bother with a gate. Gates aren't without downsides like packages getting dropped at the gate in the snow even though the driver has a code or a lazy insurance inspector not bothering to walk a couple hundred feet and getting a letter that your insurance is being canceled. They also slow down the fire department. I've messed with a few gates but am by no means an expert. You could either trench and run power for a gate or try to go solar. If you do solar, cameras and related gear will add to your power budget (plan on around 30 extra watts). Trenching would be more reliable and might not cost that much more, but your soil looks pretty rocky.

    The hill doesn't seem that big in your pictures, but it's hard to tell. If all of the trees were gone and you were standing on the roof would you be able to see where the road and driveway meet (line of sight for wifi)? How high up the wall of the house would you have to go to get to a point where you'd be able to see the road in this scenario?

    If you haven't seen IPVM Camera Calculator V3 you should play with that a little.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019
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  5. RichardPryor

    RichardPryor Young grasshopper

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    Electrical work comes easy to me for some reason. I wired my shop and wiring my house. I also “wired” my camera system, but that was as simple as pulling wire through studs and connecting to the receiver. Networking has always been my Achilles heal. Not sure why but I can’t really seem to grasp it.

    I’m doing fiberglass and also doing it myself. I did spray foam in the shop and not a big fan, specially considering the cost.

    I got attic trusses and the plan was to use it as an office/network room and also store my (big) guns and valuables in there. I planned on having my router, NAS, desktop, security camera receiver (or whatever you call it) all there and from there it would feed my AVR downstairs and to different rooms so I can stream movies/music. Do you think this is a good idea? Don’t like when intruders could have easy access to my valuables and camera system etc.

    [​IMG]

    What kind of utilities are you talking about? Internet is weak here in rural Oregon. I’m hoping I can add two ISP services to make one faster connection because right now d/l speeds are 6megs. It’s dsl century link. I bought a bunch of ubiquiti access points as well.

    Not yet and I was going to use that trench to put cat6 from shop cameras to house.

    Most people have a gate around here. I feel completely exposed without one. It’s like giving people a green light to come into my property. It won’t be closed at all times.

    Don’t think I can see road from the roof of the house. Trenching is cheap and it won’t have to be too deep.

    I’ll click on that link now. Thanks for your time @tangent and everyone else. Really appreciate it. I’ll have more questions for sure!
     
  6. Pmedicj

    Pmedicj Getting the hang of it

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    You want the best, Well here it is.....
    PSD81602-A360 https://www.dahuasecurity.com/products/productDetail/12641

    8x 2mp cameras for a 360' view and a PTZ with intelligent functions. Set up tripwire and intrusion zones on the eight cameras and when the rules are tripped have it activate the PTZ. Mount this baby on a pole above and have 360' coverage "Instant perimeter coverage"
     
  7. Whoaru99

    Whoaru99 Pulling my weight

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    I've seen this a lot here. Could you clarify the intent?

    There is the T-568 standard itself, then there is T-568A pinout and T-568B pinout.

    Last time I looked at the T-568 standard, it said for horizontal wiring (which would be like from patch panel to wall jack) T-568A pinout is the primary method.

    Are you suggesting all cabling use T-568B pinout, horizontal wiring and patch cables?
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2019
  8. toliman

    toliman n3wb

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    To avoid confusion, T-568B is most common. If you wire to a patch panel, keystone or wall socket, or Krone block, most will stick with 568B layout. Which should be Orange/Blue/Brown, with green in the 3/6 pins.

    Some crimping tools will have the wiring guide on a sticker, and the Krone/keystones will have color-coded punch areas.
    With practise, you'll remember. After you crimp 20-200 cables, you won't forget.

    If you see Orange/Blue/Brown it's 568B. If it's Green/Blue/Brown on one, or both, it's Crossover/Patch cabling, using 568A.
    You'll probably never see 568A unless you deal with cisco gear, console cables, crossover/patch cables or bargain bin stuff.

    But, the good news is, it doesn't matter.

    1) There's Cat5/6 cable testers that will show if there's an A/B crossover, and/or if PoE voltage/wattage is capable of 15/30/60w (bit more expensive, but useful for testing voltage/current drop due to broken/bad cables),
    or if there's voltage drop/crosstalk (Fluke testers, $$$$, daily hire is $50-100/day).

    PoE testers can be complicated, but a mixed network/PoE tester is useful if you're adding more than a few cameras over time.

    2) Modern switches can handle the crossover between 568A and 568B (MDIX support),
    or you can use a crossover cable, which has the Orange/Green pairs swapped on one end of the cable/patch cable.
     
  9. Whoaru99

    Whoaru99 Pulling my weight

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    That is sort of why I asked, how 568B pinout is dubbed (or got to be?) more common when the 568 standard still says 568A as primary pinout?

    I wonder if it started because the 568 standard evolved to rev B, so people just presumed that meant 568B pinout was the preferred? But, even in the current revision of the 568 standard still gives 568A pinout as primary, with 568B pinout as alternate.
     
  10. looney2ns

    looney2ns IPCT Contributor

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    Been discussed to death here. Take the advice and wire all network cables to the 568B standard.
    See wiki.org for explanations.
     
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  11. toliman

    toliman n3wb

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    Essentially, 568B evolved out as manufacturers started to make patch panels and Cat5/5A/6 gear use 568B.

    I'm sure there was a tipping point somewhere in the mid 90's when FE (Fast Ethernet, 100mbit) and gigabit was just starting out, but Auto-MDIX made crossover cables less of a necessity when people switched from 10/100 to Gigabit.
    Auto MDI-X support used to add a few dollars onto the cost of gigabit, which was why it was slow to adopt. That, and you usually had to upgrade PC's for early speed WiFi and gigabit, as they weren't fast enough in the mid 2000's to do either without addon PCIe cards.

    We are talking ~20 years ago, so it's not impossible to find, but most of the new gear is Cat6 ready.

    as mentioned, TIA and everything post 1000-FDX, is 568B, but the port can auto-negotiate if you get stuck.

    edit: to avoid the derailing, discussions of intra-floor, or horizontal cabling , horizontal/backbones.

    EIA/TIA-568 isn't just the wire order in the RJ45 plug, 568/568A/568B includes standards for shielding, ground impedance, STP/UTP materials, wire gauge/thickness, the colors of the wires, ordering, the number & ordering of pair twists, specs for impedance, grounding, distances, voltages, and the correct twisting of wire pairs. etc.

    EIA/TIA-568A also specs Shielded and Unshielded cables, UL certified and non-UL, etc. As noted, it's bureaucratic in nature.

    Cat6 is easier to remember & use/refer to, than EIA/TIA-568B, it's also more useful than the entire string that's printed on every ethernet cable "EIA/TIA-568B Certified (UL) Cat5e Cable, MDI, Full Duplex" sic.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2019
  12. Whoaru99

    Whoaru99 Pulling my weight

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    I did, and still see the 568 standard says 568A pinout is the primary recommendation for horizontal cables. Hence, my head scratching for all 568B.

    But, I didn't really intend to derail the thread so I'll leave it at that. :offtopic:
     
  13. tangent

    tangent IPCT Contributor

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    Have you ever terminated Ethernet or Coaxial cable before? Installed alarm sensors? Speaker wiring?
    Here are some good videos on networking
    Here are a couple of useful websites:
    Structured Wiring Overview
    Structured Wiring - How To - wire your own home network, video and telephone
    It is possible to over do it and there are some things the people who made these websites did that I don't like.
    The upper level is fine, but may result in longer cable runs and more time. You can certainly create a fairly secure location elsewhere in the house for network equipment. For example, you could sheath the walls in a closet under the stairs with OSB and cement board. If you use the 'attic' consider building a small closet between a set of trusses.
    I'm referring to internet, phone, and television (sat, cable, and/or antenna). A WISP like webformix or primetime is probably the best internet alternative in your area though they're expensive. Satellite is also an option. You simply want to plan for connecting your networking equipment to the outside world. Shockingly, some people forget this step.
    You never know in the future fiber to the home could be available.
    I'd use fiber between the shop and house it wouldn't cost that much more.
    My point was that you've got a lot of other things that are more time sensitive and the gate could wait, at least a little while. Depending on how knit picky the electrical inspector is running power to the gate could be more of a pain than it should be. It could always be done after the inspection. For a gate, you could run burial rated Cat-6 from the shop or run fiber. You could even bury an empty conduit.

    There's a lot of information in the wiki and cliff notes and in past threads. Like these:
    How to properly wire/mount cameras... new construction
    Cabinet Installed for large home install, Plus prewire pics
    Camera selection help...
    Network closets: Your pics and....
    Need help determining which camera(s) I should buy

    There are also a lot of rabbit holes you could go down and 3 weeks isn't a lot of time. IDK how much control you have over the schedule.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2019
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  14. achalmersman

    achalmersman Getting the hang of it

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    From my experience, for the underground pull to the shop I would use fiber if I had it all to do over again. I did a 300' run of CAT6 with underground cable inside flexable underground non metallic conduit and it was not properly grounded or hooked to surge suppression equipment. Just hooked to patch panels / PoE switches on both ends. One thunderstorm within a few months got both PoE switches at the same time on both ends. Poof. Netgear ProSafes. Now have suppression devices on both ends but I would run fiber if I had it to do again. Or Ubiquity wireless point to point like I've done at other locations and has been extremely reliable.

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
     
  15. RichardPryor

    RichardPryor Young grasshopper

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    They did power trench from shop to house today.
    [​IMG]

    I will also put a 2” conduit in there exclusively for the dsl/century link cable from road to shop to house.

    I will also need conduit for: (1) cameras from shop to house (8 at most), (2) gate camera (450-500ft to house/network room), (3) gate power, and (4) any other hardwiring I’ll want between shop and house for future whatever.

    Do I have my bases covered?

    It’s too overwhelming for me to learn all this stuff with what I’ve got going on, and indeed I am on a tight schedule @tangent.

    Can you please give me a link ( amazon, etc) for the exact fiber cable I should buy? I’m using grey schedule 40 electric conduit for everything.

    Thanks for all the articles and help. It is really appreciated.
     
  16. tangent

    tangent IPCT Contributor

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    You don't need to run that many cables between the shop and house. You can put a network switch in the shop and connect everything in the shop to that. Same goes for the gate, in the cabinet you run power to for a gate opener (I assume you're planning on one) you could put a PoE switch for the cameras. Pull string is a lot cheaper than cable and will help you run other cable through the conduit in the future if needed. This is a much better option than packing the conduit full of cable you DO NOT need.

    Ethernet over STP/UTP cable has a limit of 100 meters (328'). To go beyond that you're supposed to use a network switch very 100m (assumes power is available). Fiber can go much farther and doesn't conduct lightning. When I looked the other day I found some burial rated fiber with 6 strands of multi-mode fiber for around $1.50/foot. 2 strands of fiber are used in the type of setup you're looking at, one for transmit the other receive and hooked to media converters or SFP transceivers.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
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  17. RichardPryor

    RichardPryor Young grasshopper

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    So 8 cameras in shop (including the gate camera) to a switch, then 1 network cable (fiber) from switch in shop to house, correct?

    Can you please provide a link to the fiber cable you’re talking about and that I need to buy please @tangent. I will need it from gate to shop (for 1 camera) and from shop (switch) to house, correct?

    Thank you!
     
  18. RichardPryor

    RichardPryor Young grasshopper

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    I also want some kind of intercom for the gate.
     
  19. RichardPryor

    RichardPryor Young grasshopper

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    Does a switch need electricity or is it fed by PoE?
     
  20. tangent

    tangent IPCT Contributor

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    A switch needs electricity. There are some PoE powered PoE switches, but they need to be supplied by a higher power output variant of PoE and are much more limited in the amount of power they can supply to other devices. If power is available a switch that plugs in is better choice.

    For your gate, you're probably looking at running some 12-2 or 10-3 UF cable for power for a gate opener fed from a GFCI breaker.
     
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