New Here and looking or ways to setup home surveillance.

[jbkel]

Hello,
Currently in the research phase in building out a home surveillance system. I want to buy the hardware and do it myself, it will be a project to learn and play. I have a little background in casino surveillance and a little background in networking. Sorry if anything I say sounds illogical, I'm learning. I also understand I will not have industry class software and hardware from the likes of Pelco, Avigilon, Genetec, ect.

What I would like to accomplish is installing the networking with used Cisco switches and router. This would sit behind my cable modem and home router. I want to set up a server or PC to record and store the IP camera data and access it across the network, i.e. my main computer where I would be able to watch the recorded video and scrub the timeline. Basically a workstation that can access the data.

I apologize if the information is vague but any insight would be appreciated.

 

[SouthernYankee]

Read study plan before spending money.
Go slow, start small and grow.
=========================
My standard welcome to the forum message.

Read Study Plan before spending money
Cameras are for surveillance to get information for after the fact.

Please read the IP Cam Talk Cliff Notes and other items in the IP Cam Talk Wiki. (read on a real computer, not a phone). The wiki is in the blue bar at the top of the page.

Read How to Secure Your Network (Don't Get Hacked!) in the wiki also.

Quick start
1) If you do not have a wired monitored alarm system, get that first
2) your first camera should be a good variable focus camera to check camera placement and the correct lens.
3) Use Dahua starlight cameras or Hikvision darkfighter cameras if you need good low light cameras.
4) use a VPN to access home network (openVPN)
5) Do not use wifi cameras.
6) Do not use cloud storage
7) Do Not use uPNP, P2P, QR, do not open ports,
8) More megapixel is not necessarily better.
9) Avoid chinese hacked cameras (most ebay, amazon, aliexpress cameras(not all, but most))
10) Do not use reolink, ring, nest, Arlo cameras (they are junk), no cloud cameras
11) If possible use a turret camera , bullet collect spiders, dome collect dirt and reflect light (IR)
12) Use only solid copper, AWG 23 or 24 ethernet wire. , no CCA (Copper Clad Aluminum)
13) use a test mount to verify the camera mount location. My test rig: rev.2
14) (Looney2ns)If you want to be able to ID faces, don't mount cams higher than 7ft. You want to know who did it, not just what happened.
15) Use a router that has openVPN built in (Most ASUS, Some NetGear....)
16) camera placement use the calculator... IPVM Camera Calculator V3
17) POE list PoE Switch Suggestion List
18) Camera Sensor size, bigger is general better Sensor Size Chart
19) Camera lens size, a bigger number give more range but less field of view. Which Security Camera Lens Size Should I Buy?
20) verify your camera placement, have a friend wearing a hoodie, ball cap and sunglasses looking down approach the house, can you identify them ?

Cameras to look at
IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED . Review IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED (Full Color, Starlight+) - 4MP starlight
.................... Dahua IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED review
IPC-T5442TM-AS ..... Review-OEM 4mp AI Cam IPC-T5442TM-AS Starlight+ - 4MP starlight+
IPC-HDW5442-ZE ..... Dahua IPC-HDW5442T-ZE 4MP Varifocal Turret - Night Perfomance testing -- variable focus 4 MP Starlight
IPC-B5442E-ZE ...... Review - OEM IPC-B5442E-ZE 4MP AI Varifocal Bullet Camera With Starlight+
IPC-HFW7442H-Z ..... Review - Dahua IPC-HFW7442H-Z 4MP Ultra AI Varifocal Bullet Camera -- MP variable focus AI
IPC-T2347G-LU ...... Review of the Hikvision OEM model IPC-T2347G-LU 'ColorVu' IP CCTV camera. (DS-2CD2347G1-LU)
IPC-HDW2231R-ZS .... Review-Dahua IPC-HDW2231RP-ZS Starlight Camera-Varifocal
IPC-HDW2231T-ZS-S2 . Review-OEM IPC-T2231T-ZS 2mp Varifocal Starlight Camera
IPC-HDW5231R-ZE .... Review-Dahua Starlight IPC-HDW5231R-ZE 800 meter capable ePOE
IPC-HFW4239T-ASE ... IPC-HFW4239T-ASE
IPCT-HDW5431RE-I ... Review - IP Cam Talk 4 MP IR Fixed Turret Network Camera
IPC-T5241H-AS-PV ... Review-OEM IPC-T5241H-AS-PV 2mp AI active deterrence cam
IPC-T3241-ZAS ...... Review-OEM IPC-T3241-ZAS 2mp AI Lite series Varifocal -- 2mp AI Lite series Varifocal
IPC-HFW2831T-ZS ... Review-Dahua IPC-HFW2831T-ZS 8MP WDR IR Bullet Network Camera -- 8MP Bullet 1/1.8” sensor variable focus.
DS-2CD2325FWD-I
N22AL12 ............ New Dahua N22AL12 Budget Cam w/Starlight -- low cost entry
IPC-T2347G-LU....... Review-Loryta OEM 4MP IPC-T2347G-LU ColorVu Fixed Turret Network 4mm lens & Junction Box -- 4MP ColorVu
.................... Review of the Hikvision OEM model IPC-T2347G-LU 'ColorVu' IP CCTV camera.

Other dahua 4MP starlight

https://ipcamtalk.com/threads/dahua-4mp-starlight-lineup.42000/#post-388253

My preferred indoor cameras
DS-2CD2442FWD-IW
IPC-K35A

https://ipcamtalk.com/threads/review-dahua-ipc-k35a-3mp-cube-camera.37581/#post-373517

If interested in Blue Iris and other setup items see the following post

Newbie Starter Guide to IP Cam System – VPN setup – Computer Hardware – Blue Iris – Dahua Cameras

This is an intermediate / newbie guide for people just starting out looking for a surveillance setup. I know this setup might not be for everyone and there are many options. You can find a lot of this information in the Wiki: IP Cam Talk Wiki | IP Cam Talk A great place to start in the Wiki...

ipcamtalk.com

Before asking a question search the forum first...
The best way to search the forum is to use Google
In the google search window enter.. site:ipcamtalk.com ?????? ..where ?????? is the items/terms you are interested in.
Example site:ipcamtalk.com PALE MOON BROWSER

Read,study,plan before spending money ..... plan plan plan
Test do not guess

 

[samplenhold]

What I would like to accomplish is installing the networking with used Cisco switches and router. This would sit behind my cable modem and home router.

Welcome to the forum. You do not need another router behind your home router. Since you are here, I will assume you are looking for IP cams. Really check out the info @SouthernYankee posted above. You can either go with an NVR or a PC running cam software like Blue Iris. Personally I went with a PC and Blue Iris (BI). You don't need enterprise grade equipment (like Cisco) for your home. I just run Netgear SOHO or other models of POE switches, but many here swear by getting used enterprise switches from eBay.

If you decide to go the NVR route, it is a good idea to choose all one brand of cams and NVR. Mixing brands will give you headaches. However, if you go the PC and BI route, then mixing brands of cams is fine. Personally I have gone with all Dahua cams. Currently have 18 cams recording spread over 10 different models. Have five more on the bench to install once the temps get a little cooler.

Before you go buying all of your cams and installing them, it is a good idea to make a plan and test out each location. Buy one varifocal cam and build a test rig like discussed in the Cliff Notes to test out your plan/ideas. This will help you to decide which models will work best for each location. I believe in fit-for-purpose picking of cams. That is why I have 10 different models.

 

[jbkel]

Welcome to the forum. You do not need another router behind your home router. Since you are here, I will assume you are looking for IP cams. Really check out the info @SouthernYankee posted above. You can either go with an NVR or a PC running cam software like Blue Iris. Personally I went with a PC and Blue Iris (BI). You don't need enterprise grade equipment (like Cisco) for your home. I just run Netgear SOHO or other models of POE switches, but many here swear by getting used enterprise switches from eBay.

If you decide to go the NVR route, it is a good idea to choose all one brand of cams and NVR. Mixing brands will give you headaches. However, if you go the PC and BI route, then mixing brands of cams is fine. Personally I have gone with all Dahua cams. Currently have 18 cams recording spread over 10 different models. Have five more on the bench to install once the temps get a little cooler.

Before you go buying all of your cams and installing them, it is a good idea to make a plan and test out each location. Buy one varifocal cam and build a test rig like discussed in the Cliff Notes to test out your plan/ideas. This will help you to decide which models will work best for each location. I believe in fit-for-purpose picking of cams. That is why I have 10 different models.

Thank both of you for the information. The reason for the switch and router equipment is because I am an IT student working on my CCNA at the moment and it gives me a reason to set up a home lab with actual functionality.

Good Idea on the varifocal camera to understand placement and field of view. What I dealt with in the Casino industry was that the raw data was recorded to a server and you viewed the streams and did your recording on a client station attached to the network. That is kind of what I am looking for but I understand that it may not be possible without expensive solutions that I am not going to partake in. Blue Iris does look awesome though and my just go that route.

 

[samplenhold]

The reason for the switch and router equipment is because I am an IT student working on my CCNA at the moment and it gives me a reason to set up a home lab with actual functionality.

Cool. It is a good idea to NOT route cam traffic through your router. No reason to. It is also a good idea to isolate the cams from the internet and the rest of your LAN. Either by using VLANs or physical isolation. I am using physical isolation as it is the simplest way to do it.

 

[sebastiantombs]

Order one varifocal camera first and try out each of your locations. From what I can see, the one on the side, near the peak, is wayyyyy too high and won't provide anything useful enough to identify who did what or maybe even what they did with any real detail. The general rule of thumb is to install cameras no higher than seven feet, about two meters. to be able to properly identify miscreants. The other two in the front are also too high to be effective for identification.

Read the information in the Cliff Notes, in the blue bar at the top of the page. There is a lot of excellent information there regarding camera types, placement and building up an EFFECTIVE system. Above all, test before starting the installation of any camera. Test by wearing a cap and/or a hoodie, or have a friend do the test, and see if you can identify who is in the scene well enough to be useful.

The varifocal camera will let you see what lens size is needed as well. There is a converter in the Cliff Notes to assist with that determination. That camera can also be used in the final installation as well, so it's not a waste of money.

 

[izzy]

Order one varifocal camera first and try out each of your locations. From what I can see, the one on the side, near the peak, is wayyyyy too high and won't provide anything useful enough to identify who did what or maybe even what they did with any real detail. The general rule of thumb is to install cameras no higher than seven feet, about two meters. to be able to properly identify miscreants. The other two in the front are also too high to be effective for identification.

Read the information in the Cliff Notes, in the blue bar at the top of the page. There is a lot of excellent information there regarding camera types, placement and building up an EFFECTIVE system. Above all, test before starting the installation of any camera. Test by wearing a cap and/or a hoodie, or have a friend do the test, and see if you can identify who is in the scene well enough to be useful.

The varifocal camera will let you see what lens size is needed as well. There is a converter in the Cliff Notes to assist with that determination. That camera can also be used in the final installation as well, so it's not a waste of money.

Thanks Sebastianbombs, I just realized I posted in someone else's thread.

 

[VideoQ]

Cool. It is a good idea to NOT route cam traffic through your router. No reason to. It is also a good idea to isolate the cams from the internet and the rest of your LAN. Either by using VLANs or physical isolation. I am using physical isolation as it is the simplest way to do it.

How do you have it set up? What are you using to access your system from outside the network ? From what I have been gathering on there the most secure way is separate router and access via openvpn. I have personally just been using teamviewer to get in to a pc running the vms, however it is a huge pain and very slow.

 

[samplenhold]

How do you have it set up? What are you using to access your system from outside the network ?

I am using Blue Iris and have all of my cams on a separate LAN. The BI PC has dual NIC as does my office PC. This allows me to access cams directly from my office PC.
See the simplified diagram below.


Currently I use Teamviewer for off site access, but we are at odds right now as TV says I am using it for commercial purposes (which I am not). When I went through their protest procedure, they agreed but I still get the message and the connection drops at 30 seconds. One of these days I will try and get a VPN working, but the modem/router supplied from my ISP does not allow it.

What's with the link to Outboard Marine Corp?

 

[Old Timer]

I am using Blue Iris and have all of my cams on a separate LAN. The BI PC has dual NIC as does my office PC. This allows me to access cams directly from my office PC.
See the simplified diagram below.
View attachment 75751

Currently I use Teamviewer for off site access, but we are at odds right now as TV says I am using it for commercial purposes (which I am not). When I went through their protest procedure, they agreed but I still get the message and the connection drops at 30 seconds. One of these days I will try and get a VPN working, but the modem/router supplied from my ISP does not allow it.

What's with the link to Outboard Marine Corp?

Open VPN is the way to go 100%. As an IT student you need to know about it also. You might want to look
into PF sense for your router it's open source, and works great on the Proectli fanless with Celeron.

Team viewer makes a good backup connection as it's easy to cross platforms with it.
Although if you load it on a server, use it on a domain, have long connections, or try to have 2 connections
at the same time, they will call you a commercial user and make you pay.

If you have no public IP, you can play with ngrok.io for an inbound connection, as a work around.

 

[VideoQ]

I am using Blue Iris and have all of my cams on a separate LAN. The BI PC has dual NIC as does my office PC. This allows me to access cams directly from my office PC.
See the simplified diagram below.
View attachment 75751

Currently I use Teamviewer for off site access, but we are at odds right now as TV says I am using it for commercial purposes (which I am not). When I went through their protest procedure, they agreed but I still get the message and the connection drops at 30 seconds. One of these days I will try and get a VPN working, but the modem/router supplied from my ISP does not allow it.

What's with the link to Outboard Marine Corp?

Thanks for the speedy reply! Interesting setup. So if I am understanding this correctly you are using your BI + Office PC's on 2 different networks essentially.
When you want to get out to the internet the network card port on the 192.168.1 is what you are going through.
To access BI, and in turn the cameras, you use the other port on the 192.168.2

Would it not have been easier and more effective to put the cameras on a VLAN ?

The link was an oops! something I had copied and accidentally pasted! Thanks for catching that.

 

[SouthernYankee]

A vlan sound nice, if you trust the software. You still have to block the camera vlan from accessing the internet and your router. The use of two nic card on a PC that does not route provides physical separation. On the above example you access the BI computer and office PC on the 192.168.1.x subnet. For BI you will use the web browser to view the cameras using the 192.168.1. address of the BI PC. You only use the 192.168.2.x to directly access the cameras, you can only access the cameras directly from the the BI PC and office PC

 

[samplenhold]

Would it not have been easier and more effective to put the cameras on a VLAN ?

Not for me. My office PC's motherboard has two NICs. The BI PC, it was easy and cheap to put a second NIC in. Setting up VLANs would require hardware that supports it which none of mine do. Plus it would have meant learning about VLANs, which I do not know anything about. But putting in a second NIC was simple. I do not think anything could be more effective than a physical isolation.

 

[sebastiantombs]

Using a second NIC is the KISS solution that works every time with no additional "major" hardware needed.

 

[VideoQ]

Not for me. My office PC's motherboard has two NICs. The BI PC, it was easy and cheap to put a second NIC in. Setting up VLANs would require hardware that supports it which none of mine do. Plus it would have meant learning about VLANs, which I do not know anything about. But putting in a second NIC was simple. I do not think anything could be more effective than a physical isolation.

Either way a very simple and effective solution. Something I never even thought of. Thanks for taking the time to share.

 

[samplenhold]

Either way a very simple and effective solution. Something I never even thought of.

If you have not yet, read the Cliff Notes and check out the WIKI. This is covered there.