New member researching my first POE IP camera system

T

TheGooginator

Getting the hang of it
Jun 26, 2020
92
71
California
Hello everyone,

My name is Ryan and I found this community after searching through some reddit threads and various Youtube Videos. I currently have a 2 outdoor camera Nest and doorbell system that I am looking to replace with POE IP cameras and an NVR. My primary objective is to obtain better visuals of my driveway and street I live in a cul de sac at the end and every week or so in the middle of the next my Nest captures vehicles driving around slowly looking for packages on peoples doorstep. I want to be able to record and make out license plates.

Other than that I would like to add additional cameras around my house to complete coverage as I only monitor the front of my house atm. I hope to learn a lot as I dive into these forums and appreciate any advice that can be given.

My initial thoughts are to purchase Amcrest 4k bullet cameras at either 4MM or 6MM to focus on the street in front of my driveway to meet my primary objective or purchase an optical zoom camera then purchase 2.8MM cameras around the rest of my house for wider FOV.
 
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Hello Ryan, welcome to the forum.
 
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Welcome Ryan,
You are on the right track with optical zoom being important for license plates recognition (LPR). There is a section in Hardware - IP Cameras - LPR where they are discussed. IPC-HFW5231E-Z12E is a popular choice for LPR with it's 12x optical zoom.
 
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TheGooginator said:
My initial thoughts are to purchase Amcrest 4k bullet cameras at either 4MM or 6MM to focus on the street in front of my driveway to meet my primary objective or purchase an optical zoom camera then purchase 2.8MM cameras around the rest of my house for wider FOV.
Click to expand...
If you're going to be doing any night time recording, you might want to check the Dahua/Hik cameras that use the 4MP 1/1.8" image sensor. Bang for buck, they're about the best in terms of low-light performance. That image sensor isn't available in consumer brands like Amcrest/Lorex/etc yet.

One of he most challenging part of recording at night is getting a recording where the details aren't blurry when the object is in motion (i.e. facial features of someone in your driveway at 2AM as they're walking around your cars). It's really easy to change a camera's settings so it takes a beautiful low-light picture when nothing is moving, but those same settings work against trying to get non-blurry motion. So don't think that a camera performs great at night just because it takes great pics when everything is still.

If you haven't already stumbled across it, IPVM Camera Calculator V3 is a great way to test out if a 4MM/6MM/varifocal lens will give you enough PPF to identify someone. Type in your address, drop a camera on the map, position it around your house, set the brand/lens, then drag the little digital dude out the street at the end of your driveway and see what the PPF value is. If you want the best chances of ID'ing someone, shoot for a PPF value of 100+. Unless your driveway is relatively short, you'll probably need a varifocal (optical zoom) model.

This model is a pretty popular varifocal model and gets a lot of good reviews:
Review - OEM IPC-B5442E-ZE 4MP AI Varifocal Bullet Camera With Starlight+
 
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aristobrat said:
If you're going to be doing any night time recording, you might want to check the Dahua/Hik cameras that use the 4MP 1/1.8" image sensor. Bang for buck, they're about the best in terms of low-light performance. That image sensor isn't available in consumer brands like Amcrest/Lorex/etc yet.

One of he most challenging part of recording at night is getting a recording where the details aren't blurry when the object is in motion (i.e. facial features of someone in your driveway at 2AM as they're walking around your cars). It's really easy to change a camera's settings so it takes a beautiful low-light picture when nothing is moving, but those same settings work against trying to get non-blurry motion. So don't think that a camera performs great at night just because it takes great pics when everything is still.

If you haven't already stumbled across it, IPVM Camera Calculator V3 is a great way to test out if a 4MM/6MM/varifocal lens will give you enough PPF to identify someone. Type in your address, drop a camera on the map, position it around your house, set the brand/lens, then drag the little digital dude out the street at the end of your driveway and see what the PPF value is. If you want the best chances of ID'ing someone, shoot for a PPF value of 100+. Unless your driveway is relatively short, you'll probably need a varifocal (optical zoom) model.

This model is a pretty popular varifocal model and gets a lot of good reviews:
Review - OEM IPC-B5442E-ZE 4MP AI Varifocal Bullet Camera With Starlight+
Click to expand...

Thank you aristobrat I am going to go play with the IPVM Calculator a bit today and see what cameras would work best. My driveway is pretty short and I don't need to look too far into the street but we will see after I play around whether I need optical zoom or not.
 
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Tekbotslaya said:
Welcome Ryan,
You are on the right track with optical zoom being important for license plates recognition (LPR). There is a section in Hardware - IP Cameras - LPR where they are discussed. IPC-HFW5231E-Z12E is a popular choice for LPR with it's 12x optical zoom.
Click to expand...

Thanks Tekbotslaya I will definitely be looking into this section of the forum as it is my primary concern atm but I am sure as I read more and look into more cameras I will get the itch to blank my whole house with many cameras haha.
 
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@aristobrat I spent some time on the IPVM and added your recommended Dahua IPC-B5442-ZE as well as the Amcrest IP8MMB2546EW and set my subject to 65 feet which is well into the middle of the cul de sac I am aiming to focus on. Both zoomed in all the way I receive a much better PPF score on the Amcrest which I am guessing is because it is a 4k camera. Dahua gives 47.6 PPF while the Amcrest gives 81.2 PPF. In my situation I don't believe I will be using the infared leds as I have a street light pole on the corner of my driveway and sit at the end of my cul de sac and every neighbor has lights on at night. I will try and get a good representation picture from my nest camera at night. Is there anything else I should be thinking about that could sway me back to the Dahua camera?

Thanks again for sending me to the IPVM tool it has been really helpful so far it might push me into a 12x zoom camera if I can convince myself to spend a little more money :).
 
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TheGooginator said:
@aristobrat I spent some time on the IPVM and added your recommended Dahua IPC-B5442-ZE as well as the Amcrest IP8MMB2546EW and set my subject to 65 feet which is well into the middle of the cul de sac I am aiming to focus on. Both zoomed in all the way I receive a much better PPF score on the Amcrest which I am guessing is because it is a 4k camera. Dahua gives 47.6 PPF while the Amcrest gives 81.2 PPF. In my situation I don't believe I will be using the infared leds as I have a street light pole on the corner of my driveway and sit at the end of my cul de sac and every neighbor has lights on at night. I will try and get a good representation picture from my nest camera at night. Is there anything else I should be thinking about that could sway me back to the Dahua camera?

Thanks again for sending me to the IPVM tool it has been really helpful so far it might push me into a 12x zoom camera if I can convince myself to spend a little more money :).
Click to expand...

@TheGooginator

Yes the 4K model will give you better PPF ratings vs the 4MP ( or a 2MP ) model, however in low light conditions it will typically not perform as well due to the pixel size on the imaging chip ( example a 4MP camera with a 1/1.8" chip has a significantly larger pixel vs a 8MP / 4K UHD 1/1.8" chip )
 
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mat200 said:
@TheGooginator

Yes the 4K model will give you better PPF ratings vs the 4MP ( or a 2MP ) model, however in low light conditions it will typically not perform as well due to the pixel size on the imaging chip ( example a 4MP camera with a 1/1.8" chip has a significantly large pixel vs a 8MP / 4K UHD 1/1.8" chip )
Click to expand...

Thanks for that Mat200 I really need to control my urge to look at the MP especially for my LPR camera I will continue to read through threads in the LPR forum and decide on that camera and build my system based on that choice.
 
:welcome:
Read Study Plan before spending money... plan plan plan.

=====================================

My standard welcome to the forum message.

Read Study Plan before spending money
Cameras are for surveillance to get information for after the fact.

Please read the IP Cam Talk Cliff Notes and other items in the IP Cam Talk Wiki. (read on a real computer, not a phone). The wiki is in the blue bar at the top of the page.

Read How to Secure Your Network (Don't Get Hacked!) in the wiki also.

Quick start
1) If you do not have a wired monitored alarm system, get that first
2) Use Dahua starlight cameras or Hikvision darkfighter cameras if you need good low light cameras.
3) use a VPN to access home network (openVPN)
4) Do not use wifi cameras.
5) Do not use cloud storage
6) Do Not use uPNP, P2P, QR, do not open ports,
7) More megapixel is not necessarily better.
8) Avoid chinese hacked cameras (most ebay, amazon, aliexpress cameras(not all, but most))
9) Do not use reolink, ring, nest, Arlo cameras (they are junk), no cloud cameras
10) If possible use a turret camera , bullet collect spiders, dome collect dirt and reflect light (IR)
11) Use only solid copper, AWG 23 or 24 ethernet wire. , no CCA (Copper Clad Aluminum)
12) use a test mount to verify the camera mount location. My test rig: rev.2
13) (Looney2ns)If you want to be able to ID faces, don't mount cams higher than 7ft. You want to know who did it, not just what happened.
14) Use a router that has openVPN built in (Most ASUS, Some NetGear....)
15) camera placement use the calculator... IPVM Camera Calculator V3
16) POE list PoE Switch Suggestion List
17) Camera Sensor size, bigger is general better Sensor Size Chart
18) Camera lens size, a bigger number give more range but less field of view. Which Security Camera Lens Size Should I Buy?


Cameras to look at
IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED . Review IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED (Full Color, Starlight+) - 4MP starlight
.................... Dahua IPC-T5442TM-AS-LED review
IPC-T5442TM-AS ..... Review-OEM 4mp AI Cam IPC-T5442TM-AS Starlight+ - 4MP starlight+
IPC-B5442E-ZE ...... Review - OEM IPC-B5442E-ZE 4MP AI Varifocal Bullet Camera With Starlight+
IPC-T2347G-LU ...... Review of the Hikvision OEM model IPC-T2347G-LU 'ColorVu' IP CCTV camera. (DS-2CD2347G1-LU)
IPC-HDW2231R-ZS .... Review-Dahua IPC-HDW2231RP-ZS Starlight Camera-Varifocal
IPC-HDW2231T-ZS-S2 . Review-OEM IPC-T2231T-ZS 2mp Varifocal Starlight Camera
IPC-HDW5231R-ZE .... Review-Dahua Starlight IPC-HDW5231R-ZE 800 meter capable ePOE
IPC-HFW4239T-ASE ... IPC-HFW4239T-ASE
IPCT-HDW5431RE-I ... Review - IP Cam Talk 4 MP IR Fixed Turret Network Camera
IPC-T5241H-AS-PV ... Review-OEM IPC-T5241H-AS-PV 2mp AI active deterrence cam
IPC-T3241-ZAS ...... Review-OEM IPC-T3241-ZAS 2mp AI Lite series Varifocal -- 2mp AI Lite series Varifocal
IPC-HFW2831T-ZS ... Review-Dahua IPC-HFW2831T-ZS 8MP WDR IR Bullet Network Camera -- 8MP Bullet 1/1.8” sensor variable focus.
DS-2CD2325FWD-I
N22AL12 ............ New Dahua N22AL12 Budget Cam w/Starlight -- low cost entry
IPC-T2347G-LU....... Review-Loryta OEM 4MP IPC-T2347G-LU ColorVu Fixed Turret Network 4mm lens & Junction Box -- 4MP ColorVu
.................... Review of the Hikvision OEM model IPC-T2347G-LU 'ColorVu' IP CCTV camera.

Other dahua 4MP starlight Dahua 4MP Starlight Lineup

My preferred indoor cameras
DS-2CD2442FWD-IW
IPC-K35A Review-Dahua IPC-K35A 3mp Cube Camera

If interested in Blue Iris and other setup items see the following post

Newbie Starter Guide to IP Cam System – VPN setup – Computer Hardware – Blue Iris – Dahua Cameras

This is an intermediate / newbie guide for people just starting out looking for a surveillance setup. I know this setup might not be for everyone and there are many options. You can find a lot of this information in the Wiki: IP Cam Talk Wiki | IP Cam Talk A great place to start in the Wiki...
ipcamtalk.com ipcamtalk.com

Before asking a question search the forum first...
The best way to search the forum is to use Google
In the google search window enter.. site:ipcamtalk.com ?????? ..where ?????? is the items/terms you are interested in.
Example site:ipcamtalk.com PALE MOON BROWSER

Read,study,plan before spending money ..... plan plan plan
Test do not guess
 
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